S60R - Big Turbo

[Ric@rdo]

There is a tuner in Europe that does the same type of tunes like hilton. Know as "contrast" on Swedespeed.
https://urbastuning.wordpress.com/about/
I'm going to have my car tuned by him early next year. Should expect 370whp with my current mods.

[jamesy12345]

There is a tuner in Europe that does the same type of tunes like hilton. Know as "contrast" on Swedespeed.
https://urbastuning.wordpress.com/about/
I'm going to have my car tuned by him early next year. Should expect 370whp with my current mods.

Are you running a K24 fella, with the 11 blade compressor wheel mentioned in your sig? Do you know what boost pressure you will be running to get 370 at the wheels?

[Ric@rdo]

Yes I do. I bought the almost new k24 from expolicev70t5 and had it rebuilt/balanced with the 11 blade from ARD.
I think it will be around 22psi.

[jamesy12345]

Yes I do. I bought the almost new k24 from expolicev70t5 and had it rebuilt/balanced with the 11 blade from ARD.
I think it will be around 22psi.

thanks for the info sounds another good option, I'd be interested to hear how you get on

[Ric@rdo]

I know that he is tuning a S60R with a k24 hibrid with a 7+7 blade, bigger maf and injectors and already hit 1450kg/h.

[jamesy12345]

I know that he is tuning a S60R with a k24 hibrid with a 7+7 blade, bigger maf and injectors and already hit 1450kg/h.

I see Viva advertise 11-blade & 7+7 wheels...
http://www.vivaperformance.com/turbo...lvo-s60r-v70r/

That flow rate is pretty big - in theory approaching 500 hp according to the link below (rule of thumb for converting flow rate to crank hp)
https://turbobygarrett.com/turbobyga...mass_flow_rate

It would be nice to see a compressor map for these different blades...or even just a map for the K24 7400 would be a good start - I looked but didn't find one yet

[kevinking2020]

There is a tuner in Europe that does the same type of tunes like hilton. Know as "contrast" on Swedespeed.
https://urbastuning.wordpress.com/about/
I'm going to have my car tuned by him early next year. Should expect 370whp with my current mods.

I've heard good reviews about contrast maps and good prices.

[kevinking2020]

Saw this the other night Cavalli turbo died after two years.

[kevinking2020]

Ard Tuning TD05 doesn't look that bad. Rated for 500BHP - http://www.ardideas.com/ARD-Tuning-TD05-20G_p_227.html

I want to go external wastegate, this sounds awesome -

[kevinking2020]

Running over 600bhp on standard engine -

[Yosser]

I wouldn't give ard a single penny, but perhaps that's just me...

[don kalmar union]

Running over 600bhp on standard engine -

500bhp on a STANDARD 'R' engine is just utter ££££.

Don.

[jamesy12345]

Saw this the other night Cavalli turbo died after two years...

Cavalli is a brand of Comp Turbos (or maybe vice versa), there's a bit more info about Comp on the net

Ard Tuning TD05 doesn't look that bad. Rated for 500BHP - http://www.ardideas.com/ARD-Tuning-TD05-20G_p_227.html...

I wouldn't give ard a single penny, but perhaps that's just me...

I wonder who does mapping for ARD now...!!

[don kalmar union]

The two owners of vehicles that bought and fitted cavali turbos here in the Uk, both now dead, had terminal problems with them.... however the mapping for them did not help in the least.....

Don.

[jamesy12345]

The two owners of vehicles that bought and fitted cavali turbos here in the Uk, both now dead, had terminal problems with them.... however the mapping for them did not help in the least.....

Don.

Yeah searching around, Comp don't seem to get particularly good reviews. Fair enough if they were cheap but the Cavalli is too hot for me

[Tim Williams]

One of the biggest problems (not the only one...) with the turbos that claim to reinvent the wheel are the very high back pressures. This causes excessively high EGTs, most don't seem bothered about this and think a stronger actuator will make it all fine. It won't, high back pressures cause a high amount of spent exhaust gas to be left in the cylinder on the induction stroke. This raises cylinder temps to dangerously high levels. If you look at the Cavelli turdbo with 0.8 Bar pumped into the actuator you still cannot pull the wastegate open! This and using a TD04 turbine housing caused the very high back pressures. Both UK cars fitted with the turbos suffered with EGTs so high that the housings turned grey. The resulting temps caused softening of the piston rings (as seen in the USA). One engine has done 30k and the other 50k. This causes PCV type symptoms and excessive lag. I ran and videoed one of the cars with the map for both cars and and it was slower than with a K24. Cavelli started saying it could run over 2 Bar, then 1.5 once all the piston rings failed and then down to 1.2Bar.

By all means if you want pub bragging rights change the wheels and claim a power increase but if you want it to be sustainable a bigger turbine housing than a K24 or TD04 one will be required.

If you want pub bragging rights and sustainable power buy a decent bigger turbo then you can have less lag and about 100BHP more plus a turbo and engine that will last.

[jamesy12345]

One of the biggest problems (not the only one...) with the turbos that claim to reinvent the wheel are the very high back pressures. This causes excessively high EGTs, most don't seem bothered about this and think a stronger actuator will make it all fine. It won't, high back pressures cause a high amount of spent exhaust gas to be left in the cylinder on the induction stroke. This raises cylinder temps to dangerously high levels. If you look at the Cavelli turdbo with 0.8 Bar pumped into the actuator you still cannot pull the wastegate open! This and using a TD04 turbine housing caused the very high back pressures. Both UK cars fitted with the turbos suffered with EGTs so high that the housings turned grey. The resulting temps caused softening of the piston rings (as seen in the USA). One engine has done 30k and the other 50k. This causes PCV type symptoms and excessive lag. I ran and videoed one of the cars with the map for both cars and and it was slower than with a K24. Cavelli started saying it could run over 2 Bar, then 1.5 once all the piston rings failed and then down to 1.2Bar.

By all means if you want pub bragging rights change the wheels and claim a power increase but if you want it to be sustainable a bigger turbine housing than a K24 or TD04 one will be required.

If you want pub bragging rights and sustainable power buy a decent bigger turbo then you can have less lag and about 100BHP more plus a turbo and engine that will last.

Very interesting that, I meant hot in terms of price mainly although I was aware that the Cavalli used a TD04 housing...I guess my green one is one of those cars, I will pass that info highlighted on to Shem in case any lasting damage has been done, although probably he is aware of it as he took the thing off for Dream3r & put a K24 back on.

Anyway that sort of experience confirms for me the Cavalli is not the way to go, & that big power* using a K24 based hybrid is either not going to happen or at least needs monitoring of EGTs.

*big power = up towards 400 hp IMHO, pretty boring by Youtube standards

//edit

another option for rich folk...IPD 4T4


https://www.ipdusa.com/products/1114...4-turbocharger

[Ric@rdo]

What about the new turbo from IPD? They claim higher hp with lower boost.

[Tim Williams]

I spoke to Shem at length about it when I had Daves car and he had yours before. The other damage was Johns cat failing and Daves spark plug melting but neither can 100% be put down to the turbo.

IPD say they have sold over 40 of the 4T4 turbos so it should be possible to find user feed back. I use an Owen Developments IHI GT30 and love it. For less power I would fit a new genuine 19T. When coupled to a slightly larger CC engine the Garrett delivers 100BHP more than a 19T and no more lag than a 19T on a 2.3.

[jamesy12345]

I spoke to Shem at length about it when I had Daves car and he had yours before. The other damage was Johns cat failing and Daves spark plug melting but neither can 100% be put down to the turbo.

IPD say they have sold over 40 of the 4T4 turbos so it should be possible to find user feed back. I use an Owen Developments IHI GT30 and love it. For less power I would fit a new genuine 19T. When coupled to a slightly larger CC engine the Garrett delivers 100BHP more than a 19T and no more lag than a 19T on a 2.3.

Cheers for the info Tim. That would maybe explain why the DP was changed out, I was wondering but didn't know enough about it at the time.

GT30 is a good starting point for some research...I better get reading
https://turbobygarrett.com/turbobyga...compressor_map

//edit

so working my way through that link...some of the numbers are just estimated (sounds better than guessed)

Horsepower target = 475 hp...crazy arse number just for example purposes, roughly 400 at the wheels on an S60R according to everyone's favourite HP calculator
Engine displacement = 2.5 litres
Max RPM = 7100 rpm
Ambient temp = 64 F or 18 C
Ambient pressure = 29.9 in hg or 14.7 psi
Volumetric efficiency = 0.9
Inlet air temperature = 100 F or 37.8 C
BSFC = 0.6
A/F ratio = 11 (conservative like )
Airflow Wa upper value = 52.3 lb/min or 1425 kg/h
Manifold pressure required MAPreq = 37.6 psi
Compressor discharge pressure = 39.6 psi
Compressor inlet pressure = 13.7 psi
Pressure ratio = 2.9
Airflow Wa lower value = 29.4 lb/min or 802.6 kg/h (don't know where is peak torque so just selected value on surge line for this PR @4000 rpm)

Stick that on the provided map for a GT3076R, 76mm, 56 trim, 0.6 A/R...green line is along PR of 2.9, between upper & lower air flow values.



Seems OK to my untrained eye? A more sensible HP target would drop the green line down a bit, so away from surge line?? Is this any use OP?