Engine.... what to do..

[mitchyboy01]

Its a very tinny cricket type noise, fast high pitched tap. Exhaust/gasket issues emmit all of wierd noises but not what we heard on Sunday...

Hi mate. Thats exactly what an exhaust gasket leak sounds like. It sounded very metallic. I couldnt believe it when i found out it was the exhaust gasket. Sounds nothing like a blow from he main pipe. Its worth whipping the manifold and dp off surely if the next option is to break it.

[960kg]

It does sound like the exhaust gasket fluttering, it will get worse as it burns through.

As regards breaking or pulling it to bits......my old Dad use to say the mechanics of a car are nothing compared to a rotten body and can always be replaced.

Keith

[Niles]

exhaust manifold gasket/ dodgy tappet.

[Wobbly Dave]

Niles - can you ring me when you get a mo?

[GregE102]

Hope you get it sorted out Andy!

As you have a concourse condition car there!

Is it my eyes or the vid but the expansion bottle looks empty in the vid? I can't see the normal blue colour or anything there?

Greg

[LiamT4]

Its too nice to break, its a fantastic looking car.

I'd keep it and sort the engine out with forged rods etc.

[martybelfastt5]

you have one of the nicest 850s the club mate, its one of the threads that that i love an update in/on but only you can decide and i hope you do save it... to me the forum would be lost without it and of course you if you jump ship for another brand. but on saying that its your money time effort and heartache that suffers not mine,i can only hope its works out pleasent ..................

[Niles]

Niles - can you ring me when you get a mo?

done. cheers.

[NORDIC R]

Breaking it must be your absolute last option Andy
I idlise your car chum its beautiful!!!!!
If you were to break it or sell it youd only regret it and want another one to do it all again at a dearer cost
Hope you find your problem chum

[shrekblackR]

im sure with all the good guys in this club we can get it sorted between us DONT SELL OR BREAK mate far to nice for that buddy

[Wobbly Dave]

Just out of interest is this Damien = Spesh? If so have you spoken to the Welsh wonder about it?

[AndysR]

No: 3 Andy deffo plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz U can`t brake that car or sell it it`s Damien

Thanks for you comments KG

I know how you feel Andy, these 850R's are getting to the point where things are starting to go wrong and where parts and repairs are often coming at a premium.

I cant possibly advise you on whether to strip it or not for the simple reason that I have stripped many a car when a substancial mechanical failure has occured, in all honesty I regret only one of them.

The only sound advice I can give is that if you are having doubts over whether to strip it or not in one word "dont". I know from my experience that I have always regretted something I have had to think twice about.

All that remains... heart or wallet?

Thanks Emlyn, wise words.

Personally i wouldnt break the Car, Its Mint mate and even considering all the mods you have carried out (obviously i dont know every mod you have done) and maintenance i still dont think you would get back the time/effort/money that you have spent/put into her.

So i'd say dont break it.

Return it to standard and sell the moded parts off is a resonible option, for the sake of what a engine would cost id also buy and fit that. then sell a perfect working mint 850r.

Forge it etc etc would be the way i'd go but i'd still be very interested to have that aditional boost guage wired up Just to see what actual boost you are runing. (i know you have had proffesionals) set all that up but i would still be interested to see it on a Additional Gauge, for it to be proved 20.35psi, as i think it's quite a bit more imho.

Please Buddy i cant even emagine how gutted you must feel, i also feel S**tty too mate seeing i was presant at the time.

One thing you shouldn't do is break it,

I really hope you make the right decision, And my offer still stands.

Sorry its a long winded reply mate but i've been thinking about it too.

Thanks Gav, tbh I never expected or wanted to get the money back that I've invested. At the time the reason I did what I did was to do the best thing I possibly could for the car and that has always been the case during my ownership, unfortunately it is usually the most expensive option as well.. lol

Trust me when I say that even wrapped as far round as it does the boost levels are only just above 1.4 bar when the revs allow, I've had it checked a number of times with a calibrated gauge.

Thanks again for your offer though.

Hi Andy. Sounds more like a leaking exhaust manifold gasket to me. Especially if it get quieter when warm as the metal expands and seals the gap. Might be the DP flange gasket also. Mine was making a similar sound to yours. Don't make a rash decision before checking it out. The sound goes on overrun because there is no combustion forcing the exhaust gasses out.

Trust me it's definately not a leaking exhaust manifold gasket... unfortunately

Depend's what you want out of the car mate, your lucky it's a 2nd car like mine is and ive been to hell and back with it and i know about the £XXXXX invested same as you lol, the route i would go down if i was you would be to put some rods in(£380ish) + fitting so i guess your talking a £1500 if you touch nothing else on the engine(im guessing you dont want to do it yourself lol)

Beautiful car though mate and worth keeping imho if you can.

1st dibs if you want to sell as is (before Dean or Pete get in lol)

Fair points and thanks for the kind comments but if I was to go down the rod route I might as well get the rest checked out as well and yes I wouldn't be doing it myself... lol

Re. 1st dibs you've got it

Deffinatly worth reparing

Thanks Pete.

if you break it you never loved it, i dont agree with breaking all these t5's and "R"s they are running out guys

If you knew me well enough you know that you couldn't be further from the truth with that statement Frankie but I do appreciate what you are saying about the rarity of these cars

My scooby sounded like that when I melted a piston, must say I would defiantly try fix it as it would be a shame not to!

Thanks, the engine runs as smooth as it always has done so I'd be surprised if it was a melted piston but I know the Scoobies are quite common for doing that...

Think about something else for a few days (if you can) then go to the garage and walk round it. Look at the perfection you spent 4 years working/spending/trying to achieve. Then go sit in it and ask yourself "could I rip this thing apart?"
I don't want to talk you into or out of repairing or breaking the car. I just wouldn't like to see you do something you'll regret later.

Thanks Martin, I really appreciate your comments but as I always say it's not perfection.. Trust me

Look at it this way Andy u either sell it or brake it then what are your planes!!! If it's to start another project then shorelly u must be prepared to spend the same sort of dolla what u spent on Damien... So if that's the case u mite aswel spend a 5th of that amount and get the engine forged then u can get the power u want safely 24/7...... Or if u not gunna get another car... I'll drop my washing and ironing off on the way past ok... Lol just trying to make ya smile at the shxt time mate ok choose the right path for you!!!

Fair comments but tbh this is the last modified car I will own Rotch, I've become acustom to the reliability of the company cars to want to go down the modified route again...

This was mine with a badly leaking manifold and down pipe gasket at idle!! I thought the engine was dead. It sounded fine once the leaks were sorted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wipv6Sujb-E

I appreciate what your saying and the noise does sound similar when you compare the videos but in person it's pretty clear cut what the cause of the noise is for mine.

andy for what its worth heres my bit
about 8 years ago i had to have surgery on both my hands which left me unable to maintain my beloved anglia when she needed some major chassis welding (think 350 bhp was too much for her).............so i decided to sell her and let someone else get some enjoyment from all my hard work and £xxxxxx.................after advertising the car the phone didn't stop ringing (advertised too cheep methinks)..............i told every caller the car was no longer for sale as i couldn't bear to let someone else have her after all my hard work...................so i decided to break her for spares ..........after several months of removing and selling parts it came time to get rid of the shell.................when the scrap man came and dragged my baby up onto the back of his lorry i had to walk away with tears in my eyes............how could i do this to my baby..................i have regretted this to this day and would give quite a lot to have her back...............the moral of all this waffle is don't do anything you may regret later......take time to think things through..............you will never get your money back that you have invested (but you didn't ever believe you would did you) .................thats just my rant on your issue
if i can help with anything you decide on you know where i am

Thanks Steve, I hear what your saying I really do

Stick in a good engine then rebuild the other as time and money allows

I can see what your saying but as the car is for enjoyment and not for daily transport to work etc getting the car running again temporarily isn't worth it as I'd gain nothing from fitting another standard engine to then replace it with a modded one.

I think that if you wanted to keep the car long term then you can either replace the engine with a decent 2nd hand one (not forged) and leave it at that & forge the old one? I have some reservations about using the current one if it is damaged - as we don't know what state the bores are in.

TBH if this engine is as old as you say IMHO if you want to forge one - I'd look for something a bit younger (a late C70 manual engine around 1998) - as you should forge the best possible engine you can find.

Using a straight swap engine will be easier on your pocket & you will still be able to tune it & run decent power.

At the end of the day - if the car gives you pleasure then there shouldn't be any reason not to try to keep it going. Its only money when all said and done. CARpe diem

Thanks Dave wise words

I ran an 850r auto for two years bent a rod with boost spikes on gear changes
I thrashed it for a week and it went quite!!!!
Changed the oil twice to remove any bits of metal and ran it for a further three years until I sold it.
The car is still running

Lol, is that the thrash or trash attitude.. Sounds like it worked although I'd constantly be worried that I was driving a ticking time bomb if I were to do something like that..

My bent rod taped all the time never disapeired id look at lifters if it stops on overrun also i done well over 9000 miles ona bent rod had mo problems at all just changed engine for peice of mind.

Yeah I'm pretty convinced it's a rod that has gone, don't think I'd want to use it as it is in case it caused further damage tbh..

It's not an exhaust/mani/turbo gasket thats let go....I can assure that after listening to it.

The engine doesn't sound rough/farty at all...

Its a very tinny cricket type noise, fast high pitched tap. Exhaust/gasket issues emmit all sorts of wierd noises but not what we heard on Sunday....

I would forge it mate.

Otherwise its buy something else which will either be expensive from the outset or cheap but then you will spend over the price of rods and labour getting it the way you want it.

I would recommend not rushing...leave it alone for a few weeks(if you can as a second car) then look at it with a fresh mindset. It's a lot of awesome work to undo/let go.

I reckon you can get the labour charge way cheaper than stated. If you can get the engine out with the help of friends/forum members and then have it taken somewhere. It will save a few hundred notes.

If you want help pulling anything apart i'm happy to help if around

Thanks for the offer and comments

It does sound like the exhaust gasket fluttering, it will get worse as it burns through.

As regards breaking or pulling it to bits......my old Dad use to say the mechanics of a car are nothing compared to a rotten body and can always be replaced.

Keith

Very true I was fortunate with my last car, the Orion, to have been blessed with a good structural base to work around, if I hadn't I'd have easily doubled my expenses...

exhaust manifold gasket/ dodgy tappet.

No chance

Hope you get it sorted out Andy!

As you have a concourse condition car there!

Is it my eyes or the vid but the expansion bottle looks empty in the vid? I can't see the normal blue colour or anything there?

Greg

Thanks Greg, it's good condition not concourse.. if you viewed the car in the flesh you'd see what I mean't but thanks for your kind comments

The coolant level is bang on the max line as it always has been since I've had the car, for some reason the camera doesn't show it, but as fussy as it sounds the cars levels are checked EVERYTIME I drive it as it's a slight obsession I have... lol

Its too nice to break, its a fantastic looking car.

I'd keep it and sort the engine out with forged rods etc.

Very high maintenance much like most of the fantastic looking females of this world... lol

you have one of the nicest 850s the club mate, its one of the threads that that i love an update in/on but only you can decide and i hope you do save it... to me the forum would be lost without it and of course you if you jump ship for another brand. but on saying that its your money time effort and heartache that suffers not mine,i can only hope its works out pleasent ..................

Probably one of the most poignant messages I've had since it happened. It's nice to be appreciated thank you very much

Breaking it must be your absolute last option Andy
I idlise your car chum its beautiful!!!!!
If you were to break it or sell it youd only regret it and want another one to do it all again at a dearer cost
Hope you find your problem chum

Thanks for your kind comments

im sure with all the good guys in this club we can get it sorted between us DONT SELL OR BREAK mate far to nice for that buddy

Thanks

Just out of interest is this Damien = Spesh? If so have you spoken to the Welsh wonder about it?

Damien is the cars name, nothing else or no relation to anyone, and chosen because you'd be forgiven for thinking it was possessed with the number of bad and odd things it throws my way! lol





Thanks to all who have commented, pm'd text or rung me over the last few days. Your comments mean alot and it's nice to see that the car has such a high level of regard amongst this friendly community.

As of today the car is officially off the road and I have surrendered the remaining road tax. I haven't made my mind up where I am going to go with the car yet so I opted for the "take some time out" option. It's been a long time since I diverted monies away from the car, in fact I don't think I ever have as it's always been a money no object obsession or illness if you like..! lol
Anyway I'm going to have a me year this year and spend some cash on myself go away on holiday renew the wardrobe those sorts of things. I will revisit the car situation towards the end of this year if not before. This weekend I shall over inflate the tyres, to prevent flat spotting, and prepare the car for long term storage then Damien will be locked away in the garage out of sight and mind for now.

I shall of course be at the various VPC events that I can this year and shall continue to come along to the Essex meets just as a passenger rather than a driver.

[danny-R]

Good luck with it mate, hope you get it sorted.

[Al115]

good luck from me as well Andy.

[rappid]

Sorry to hear about damien mate, well give it loads of consideration before you break or sell it ?? I would be intrested in buying it as it is..

[AndysR]

Well you've probably noticed I've not been on here much or maybe you haven't.. lol
Anyway I've been very busy on a work level with various courses and socially at weekends, most recently and this weekend was my birthday, so had put the car situation to the back of my mind somewhat. However I have decided that to break the car would be to do so a head of it's time and would contribute towards the rarity of others raising their values slightly but I'm feeling selfish so sod the values of others I'm getting mine back up and running again

I've also decided that I am going to see what else I can reasonably get out of it by means of an uprated intercooler, gearbox cooler and other little bits to improve flow etc., nothing silly just something to take the edge off of the fact I have to repair it unexpectedly.
I very much doubt it will be back this year but I hope to have it all sorted by 2013 so watch this space

[bigrotch]

Well you've probably noticed I've not been on here much or maybe you haven't.. lol
Anyway I've been very busy on a work level with various courses and socially at weekends, most recently and this weekend was my birthday, so had put the car situation to the back of my mind somewhat. However I have decided that to break the car would be to do so a head of it's time and would contribute towards the rarity of others raising their values slightly but I'm feeling selfish so sod the values of others I'm getting mine back up and running again

I've also decided that I am going to see what else I can reasonably get out of it by means of an uprated intercooler, gearbox cooler and other little bits to improve flow etc., nothing silly just something to take the edge off of the fact I have to repair it unexpectedly.
I very much doubt it will be back this year but I hope to have it all sorted by 2013 so watch this space

now thats what i wanted to hear mate good move mate.......i still havent sin it yet but least ill get a chance to see it at some point really happy for ya mate

[claymore]

Good news, I'm glad you'v seen the light

[bigrotch]

so andy u gunna forge it mmmmmmm

[dalhousie2008]

just watched the video, that sound send a chill down your spine, good luck with rebuild. Just curious what car was it? not your 850r