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Mrsmopp
Monday 30th January 2006, 10:15
Driving along as normal all is well cruising at 40 in 4th.......then nothing, diddly squat, no power at all, engine still running until you come to a standstill and then it cuts out all together. Fires straight back up after a couple of seconds as if nothing has happened.

The T5 did this 3 times over a 3 mile journey yesterday - any ideas?

x

mraldonnelly
Monday 30th January 2006, 10:46
Mrs M,

Your car's knackered - I'll buy it off you for a quid! LOL, only joking, it could be a really simple fix.

When you say the engine kept running until standstill was this with the clutch in or out?

If you're coasting in gear with the clutch out then the engine will continue to turn over albeit without power until you come to a near stop. In this scenario, if the clutch is pressed in then the engine should stall.

It sounds to me as though the engine is being starved of fuel. At a guess I go with the fuel pump relay to start with. Relay number 103 under the main fusebox cover in the engine bay on the drivers side against the bulkhead. You need to remove the torx screws to get to the relays.

If the relay has developed a poor connection internally then as it warms up it can fail. Either that or the vibrations from the road etc cause a connection to fail imtermittently. You could try giving it a good squirt of WD40 but ultimately I'd replace it. You could try a known good one from one of your many T5's first to make sure you're on the right track.

What year is the car MrsM?

Regards

Andy

Mrsmopp
Monday 30th January 2006, 10:50
Its a 95 - I wasn't driving it tho so I cant be sure of the clutch thing.

She had the beathers done on Saturday so maybe someone (volvo) has disturbed things they shouldn't have!! :slap:

x

mraldonnelly
Monday 30th January 2006, 10:55
Oh, did any dash lights come on while you were still moving (i.e. before the engine cut out)? If so, what ones (I'm after the battery one here at least)?

If not, I assume they all illuminated when the engine cut out at standstill?

Regards

Andy

mraldonnelly
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:00
Its a 95 - I wasn't driving it tho so I cant be sure of the clutch thing.

She had the beathers done on Saturday so maybe someone (volvo) has disturbed things they shouldn't have!! :slap:

x

Ah, OK, can you take her for a spin ans try to replicate the fault. As soon as you lose power stick the clutch in and see if she stalls. If so then I'd take a stab at the relay, if not then it could be a whole host of things.

Could a faulty MAF cause this? I'm thinking that maybe while coasting the engine is still getting airflow but when stopped it's not. Then again, surely the ECU would just go into limp home mode rather than die completely.

Regards

Andy

t5tart
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:15
I have a very similar fault
and have been scratching my head about it

happens out of the blue

the engine just looses all power and cuts out
the engine management light comes on ... pull over turn the key and she fires up straight away
had it a couple of times over the last 18 months

Mrsmopp
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:22
Steve has taken her into work today to get one of the technicians to look over her so I'll let you know what the outcome is and if they find anything ;)

x

r34nismo
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:26
worth while getting the afm off the car and spraying brake cleaner over it to get all the rubbish off. I have to say i read this thread and thought of the afm instantly if it is giving unreliable readings on voltages the engine light will typically come on.

In most circumstances if they dont read a solid voltage from say 1000mv to 5000mv they usually cause similar things to this, including rough idling, or a hunting type of situation as the afm works then doesnt.

mraldonnelly
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:59
I have a very similar fault
and have been scratching my head about it

happens out of the blue

the engine just looses all power and cuts out
the engine management light comes on ... pull over turn the key and she fires up straight away
had it a couple of times over the last 18 months

Just the engine light or all lights? Does this light come on before the engine dies or after?

When the engine stalls all lights should come on, just like when you first turn the key in the ignition.

Regards

Andy

madness
Monday 30th January 2006, 11:59
we usually refrain from touching the afm's in any way .
too sensitive and usually breaks them anyway

Engineer
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 19:21
Any luck with getting this problem sorted moppy?

t5tart
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 19:40
Just the engine light or all lights? Does this light come on before the engine dies or after?

When the engine stalls all lights should come on, just like when you first turn the key in the ignition.

Regards

Andy

yep first engine light then all as it dies then the engine light sometimes stays on sometimes goes off

t5tart
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 19:41
worth while getting the afm off the car and spraying brake cleaner over it to get all the rubbish off. I have to say i read this thread and thought of the afm instantly if it is giving unreliable readings on voltages the engine light will typically come on.

In most circumstances if they dont read a solid voltage from say 1000mv to 5000mv they usually cause similar things to this, including rough idling, or a hunting type of situation as the afm works then doesnt.

excuse my ignorance but whats an afm ??

Mrsmopp
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 21:36
No, it hasn't done it since *touches wood* so we haven't had her checked over tbh

x

Engineer
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 21:40
No, it hasn't done it since *touches wood* so we haven't had her checked over tbh

xI can recommend ZZ TOP'S greatest hits in the CD player always stop's mine from missing a beat lol.

BigJC
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:01
My moneys on the fuel pump relay. I had the same problem on an old 850 (20v glt) and to be honest the local dealer thought I was nuts until they took it out for a road test and nearly had a bump when it cut out!

Mrsmopp
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:05
My moneys on the fuel pump relay. I had the same problem on an old 850 (20v glt) and to be honest the local dealer thought I was nuts until they took it out for a road test and nearly had a bump when it cut out!

I would be inclined to agree with you tbh - either that or the pump itself. Next time it starts to play up she will go straight to Volvo do not pass go do not collect 200 pounds etc etc and they can see it whilst its till misbehaving!

x

mraldonnelly
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:23
Next time it starts to play up she will go straight to Volvo

Have you won the lottery MrsM?

Straight to Volvo? Main dealer?

Nah, surely not!

Mrsmopp
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:25
Its not what you know but who you know Andy ;)

x

mraldonnelly
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:38
Its not what you know but who you know Andy ;)

x

Lucky git! LOL.

mraldonnelly
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 22:40
excuse my ignorance but whats an afm ??

A MAF sensor

Air Flow Meter

Mass Air Flow sensor.

Regards

Andy

volvotuning
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:00
Perhaps a silly question, but have you checked the fault codes?

Adam.

Mrsmopp
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:04
Perhaps a silly question, but have you checked the fault codes?

Adam.

Who me?

x

volvotuning
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:05
Yes you!!! Actually I thought maybe J would have, or your superior half! :haha:

Ad.

Mrsmopp
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:10
would have, or your superior half! :haha:

Ad.

I wasn't aware I had one of those lol!!

Nope not yet, its one of the 850's not my 70 - whilst its working we dont need to get it checked lol

x

volvotuning
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:27
I wasn't aware I had one of those lol!!



Yep, the male is generally always superior in all aspects, except for washing and ironing where the female is generally the superior one. But for some strange reason, the inferior female generally is responsible for instructing the superior male what they can and can't do. And of course the superior male must abide by these instructions, if only to protect his "trouser jewels". Go figure!!!

DID I SAY THAT? :jaw: :bricks: :remybussi

Adam.

t5tart
Tuesday 31st January 2006, 23:28
A MAF sensor

Air Flow Meter

Mass Air Flow sensor.

Regards

Andy

ahhhhhhhhh right
why didnt they say maf then lol

hehe

nar its not the MAF on mine my first thought so changed it and it still did it
im starting to think its the relay too

as if i remember once it threw a mixture code
which lead me to think of the MAF as im running an induction kit

mraldonnelly
Wednesday 1st February 2006, 08:55
First port of call should be the relay. At under £30 it's probably the cheapest place to start.

Regards

Andy

Mrsmopp
Wednesday 1st February 2006, 09:24
Yep, the male is generally always superior in all aspects, except for washing and ironing where the female is generally the superior one. But for some strange reason, the inferior female generally is responsible for instructing the superior male what they can and can't do. And of course the superior male must abide by these instructions, if only to protect his "trouser jewels". Go figure!!!

DID I SAY THAT? :jaw: :bricks: :remybussi

Adam.

:rotfl: I must have been looking in the wrong places as I have yet to find a superior male (damn where are all the women on here to back me up when I need them!) :haha:

I'd bring both of mine up to you to get sorted Ad but I just cant get any time off work at the moment :(

x

Mrsmopp
Friday 3rd February 2006, 23:59
Had the codes read (happy now Adam? lol) and they came back with nothing - everything is fine according to the obie one kanobie! Yet for the last three days she has been cutting out on Steve on the way to and from work.

Volvo have had a look over the work they did on her last week and a few other bits but can find no reason for it?????

x

mraldonnelly
Saturday 4th February 2006, 10:59
Had the codes read (happy now Adam? lol) and they came back with nothing - everything is fine according to the obie one kanobie! Yet for the last three days she has been cutting out on Steve on the way to and from work.

Volvo have had a look over the work they did on her last week and a few other bits but can find no reason for it?????

x

Mrs M,

CHANGE THE FUEL PUMP RELAY!

I'll bet you a tenner it cures the problem. It's unlikely the FPR will throw a fault code because it's intermittent and all it does is cuts off the fuel to the engine when it plays up.

CHANGE IT - it will stop cutting out.

Volvo may even have one in stock - a sure sign of a common replacement item.

Regards

Andy

madness
Saturday 4th February 2006, 11:54
i've never heard of a fuel pump relay being a problem on an 850 ????????
740's etc yes!!!!
obvious test though - when it cuts out, do not turn ignition off immediately, can you hear the pump running?

i suspect cam position sensor.

volvotuning
Saturday 4th February 2006, 13:10
I'd say it's more likely the fuel pump itself.

Adam.

mraldonnelly
Saturday 4th February 2006, 19:15
I'd say it's more likely the fuel pump itself.

Adam.

Maybe, who knows, but why would the fuel pump work very intermittently? And randomly? I would've thought there would be more of a pattern to a faulty fuel pump.

Besides, £30 for a relay, or £??? for a new fuel pump and £??? or hours for fitting. Hmmmmm, I know which one I'd try first.

Mrs M, swap the FPR's between your 850's and see what happens.

Regards

Andy

volvotuning
Saturday 4th February 2006, 19:20
Andy, I always thought that too - until I had an 850 T5 turn up with an intermittent cut-out and it turned out to be exactly that. With the faulty fuel pump out of the car, I powered up the pump to see how it behaved and amazingly sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't.

I'm not saying it is the problem, but just one possibility!

I do agree with you in that checking the FPR should be one of the first things to check.

Adam.

t5tart
Saturday 4th February 2006, 19:25
with mine i seem to remember reading the code once and it threw a fuel/air mixture code....
but i had just cleaned the k&n so put it down to it sucking a bit too much

mraldonnelly
Saturday 4th February 2006, 19:27
Andy, I always thought that too - until I had an 850 T5 turn up with an intermittent cut-out and it turned out to be exactly that. With the faulty fuel pump out of the car, I powered up the pump to see how it behaved and amazingly sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't.

I'm not saying it is the problem, but just one possibility!

Adam.

Fair enough Adam,

I'm not questioning you BTW, you're the expert mate and generally, what you say goes - you work with these things every day, I've owned three and that's the only experience of Volvo mechanicals I've had (well, I've worked on a couple of 740's too but they're quite different indeed) so I think it's a safe bet to say you know best.

However, personally I would try the relay first given the relative low cost and ease of fitting - especially as Mrs M has two 850's anyway so the relays can just be swapped between the two to see if the fault goes away on one car and possibly rears its ugly head on the other.

Regards

Andy

volvotuning
Saturday 4th February 2006, 19:36
Fair enough Adam,

However, personally I would try the relay first given the relative low cost and ease of fitting - especially as Mrs M has two 850's anyway so the relays can just be swapped between the two to see if the fault goes away on one car and possibly rears its ugly head on the other.

Regards

Andy

Yes I do agree. When I had the 850R I used to borrow bits off it for that very purpose! Also relatively simple, after swapping the relay, is to check if you are getting power to the pump, ie checking continuity between the pump and the relay.

Adam.

Waxworks
Monday 6th February 2006, 11:30
So can anyone tell me where exactly the fuel pump relay lives and what colour is it???

Goof
Monday 6th February 2006, 12:44
Worth a look (borrowed from other sites):-

"The fuel pump relay is red and numbered 103. The Volvo part number for the relay is 9434225. To gain access to the 103 relay, you have to take the top cover off of the fuse box that is in the engine compartment. Remove the four 25 torx screws. Once the torx screws are out just lift the lid and you will see the relay."

"Air mass meters can cause this without leaving a code, believe it or
not. The fuel pump relay (#103 under the cover behind the fuses) and
the main relay (gray relay above the rad beside the fan relay) can also
cause you this kind of grief. Also the engine speed sensor can be the
culprit."

"...cam position sensor (which would probably
leave a code), an erratic sticking fuel pressure regulator, various
vacuum leaks that may or may not trigger a code, restricted throttle
housing, chafed or rubbing harness that could be faulty anywhere, water
in the fuel tank, a partially restricted fuel sock on the fuel pump
pickup, loose or partially backed out terminal in one of the banana
plugs under the dash, a faulty coil or coil wire, wrong spark plugs,
loose or leaking turbo hoses."

Also, consider the ignition switch - one suggestion it to wiggle the key when running. There are reports that these can also give similar problems.
:)

JUDGENINJA
Monday 6th February 2006, 16:42
Anyway....is it fixed yet....?? Do we get a diagnosis...?

Mrsmopp
Monday 6th February 2006, 18:57
Anyway....is it fixed yet....?? Do we get a diagnosis...?

Think so!! Steve has swapped the relay over with the Dragon today and all seems well *touch wood*!!

Spot on Andy!! Thank you!

x

t5tart
Monday 6th February 2006, 20:19
Think so!! Steve has swapped the relay over with the Dragon today and all seems well *touch wood*!!

Spot on Andy!! Thank you!

x

great

now i know what it may well be if it happens to mine again