Forged engine, what parts will I need?

[T5RPete]

So laying out my plans for my T5R, i'm trying to work out in which order I should do things. I'd originally thought of doing the forged internals last but I now may be changing my mind to do it first. Reason for this is i'm planning on getting on the engine work all done first before getting it converted to LPG then looking at the rest of the car.

So I need to work out what parts I actually need to be able to cost things up etc. The problem is, I don't actually know what parts make up forged 'internals'. I know it's rods and pistons, but is there anything else that needs to be done at the same time?

Is there any reputable UK suppliers of these parts? I've found Rods for sale through Kalmar Union, but i've not found a UK supplier of pistons?

Any help is greatly appreciated. :)

[p fandango]

Why not change to a lighter RN crank while you've got the bottom end stripped

[mike 850]

i didnt even think it was pistons? just thought the rods were the "weak" part?

[p fandango]

i didnt even think it was pistons? just thought the rods were the "weak" part?
pistons are good for around 450bhp so depends how high you want to go

[T5RPete]

Why not change to a lighter RN crank while you've got the bottom end stripped

Thanks for the suggestion, but I have absolutely no idea what that means...


pistons are good for around 450bhp so depends how high you want to go

Ahh, right, okay then. My aim is about 320-330 bhp, so no silly high figures!

So what else will I NEED then?

[timbo]

Have a read of this post Pete RE the RN crank,

http://volvospeed.com/vs_forum/topic/135486-revised-n-whiteblock/

[p fandango]

Thanks for the suggestion, but I have absolutely no idea what that means...
basically from a 2002 onward's engine

[cherry1809]

Rods are pretty cheap to pick up these days. Iirc blackbeast was running the China rods in his V70 with no problems.
I'll be chucking the JE pistons in with mine simply because they're already attached. Will make it future proof if me or anyone wants to go silly :)
Is it worth the hassle of a crank change? Much difference between the two?

[T5RPete]

I'm even more perplexed than I was before! Who knew there was different length rods.

So I need a set of 139.5mm forged Rods, what other parts do I actually need? Is there any other work that needs (or really should) be done at the same time?

Please excuse my ignorance, this is my first forray into proper engine modification.

[T5RPete]

Rods are pretty cheap to pick up these days. Iirc blackbeast was running the China rods in his V70 with no problems.
I'll be chucking the JE pistons in with mine simply because they're already attached. Will make it future proof if me or anyone wants to go silly :)
Is it worth the hassle of a crank change? Much difference between the two?

Sorry, what are JE pistons?

Yeah, after looking some more, i've come across these rods:
http://www.maxspeedingrods.co.uk/high-performance-volvo-850-t5-c70-v70-2-3-4340-en24-chrome-moly-forged-h-beam-connecting-rods-conrods-with-arp-bolts-x5pcs.html#.U1UqzvldWuK

But that doesn't seem right as whenever i've seen talk of forging an engine, it's seen as an expensive process. If it's just some £300 rods and labour, bugger me i'll have it done in a month!

[p fandango]

Is it worth the hassle of a crank change? Much difference between the two?
he's got to take the crank out to change the rods anyway, & 2.8kg off a chunk of rotating steels got to help

[T5RPete]

he's got to take the crank out to change the rods anyway, & 2.8kg off a chunk of rotating steels got to help

Ahh, okay, that makes sense. Is there any supporting changes or is it as simple as old out, new in?

[p fandango]

Ahh, okay, that makes sense. Is there any supporting changes or is it as simple as old out, new in?
obviously you'll have to make sure the crank shells/bearings are gapped correctly for the new crank but thats all

[Jamest5r]

Sorry, what are JE pistons?

Yeah, after looking some more, i've come across these rods:
http://www.maxspeedingrods.co.uk/high-performance-volvo-850-t5-c70-v70-2-3-4340-en24-chrome-moly-forged-h-beam-connecting-rods-conrods-with-arp-bolts-x5pcs.html#.U1UqzvldWuK

But that doesn't seem right as whenever i've seen talk of forging an engine, it's seen as an expensive process. If it's just some £300 rods and labour, bugger me i'll have it done in a month!

Keep it simple pete that's what I did.with mine, set of rods from kalmar about 380 then new oversized pistons 81.4mm from volvo(melhe) about 600 then take the block to an engine builder who will bore it and put it back together obviously with new belts and seals

[cherry1809]

Can't you get the rods in without the crank coming out? Seems a bit extreme.

[mitchyboy01]

Hi Pete,

Why go to the effort, expense and risk of stripping your engine and forging it if your aim is 320-330bhp?

[T5RPete]

Keep it simple pete that's what I did.with mine, set of rods from kalmar about 380 then new oversized pistons 81.4mm from volvo(melhe) about 600 then take the block to an engine builder who will bore it and put it back together obviously with new belts and seals

Okay, that sounds easy enough. I don't suppose you have a part number or anything, or do I just walk up to a Volvo dealer parts desk and ask for 81.4mm pistons?

[T5RPete]

Hi Pete,

Why go to the effort, expense and risk of stripping your engine and forging it if your aim is 320-330bhp?

Knowing that the engine has been rebuilt with forged rods etc gives me the peace of mind that it's going to last, it's going to be reliable and therefore I know that when I get it LPG'd it'll be good for years to come (and therefore pay off the conversion).

Then after all the engine work is done, i'll move onto the suspension, brakes etc then getting the bodywork overhauled and end up with a nice new 20 year old car :)

[merc85]

Obviously rods
Timing Belt Kit,
Waterpump
Antifreeze
Thermostat
Coolent sendor
Oil
Oil filter
Rods
==============================
If your taking the head off, then Head Gasket set, Bolts, Skim the head Valve stem seals

Budget for Machining costs if you go rebore with oversize rings

[AndysR]

A lot of the Volvo oversized pistons are discontinued so you may need to outsource those and if you are doing pistons why not go forged?
You won't know what size pistons to go for until you've had the wear to the bores measured so wait until the machine shop has checked that before you order your pistons and rings ;)

[oblark]

Volvo only list oversize piston + 0.4mm

[MoleT-5R]

Keep it simple pete that's what I did.with mine, set of rods from kalmar about 380 then new oversized pistons 81.4mm from volvo(melhe) about 600 then take the block to an engine builder who will bore it and put it back together obviously with new belts and seals

Then again, you could take Mr Fandango's advice mixed in with this advice from Jimbo, so if your engine isn't smoking at all (including start-up) you could say the bores will be ok, but give them a thorough inspection and if ok, then forged rods and suitable shells and standard (original) pistons with fresh rings. Then as Gavin (Merc85) suggests replace the service items, pulleys, water pump, seals etc, and you should have a cracking engine for small money and you know everything should be great for years to come

[oblark]

Then again, you could take Mr Fandango's advice mixed in with this advice from Jimbo, so if your engine isn't smoking at all (including start-up) you could say the bores will be ok, but give them a thorough inspection and if ok, then forged rods and suitable shells and standard (original) pistons with fresh rings. Then as Gavin (Merc85) suggests replace the service items, pulleys, water pump, seals etc, and you should have a cracking engine for small money and you know everything should be great for years to come

That`s what I`ve done with mine :)

[Wobbly Dave]

Thanks for the suggestion, but I have absolutely no idea what that means...



Ahh, right, okay then. My aim is about 320-330 bhp, so no silly high figures!

So what else will I NEED then?

GW's S60 T5

[p fandango]

That`s what I`ve done with mine :)
oh yeh, you had my old RN crank didn't you?

[oblark]

oh yeh, you had my old RN crank didn't you?

Yeap :)

[stribo]

GW's S60 T5

But that's only got about 310-315 bhp. ;)

[stribo]

You could go Dean's (WoodyT5) route, do all the supporting mods, get a decent map, and leave the internals standard. ;)

[T5RPete]

Then again, you could take Mr Fandango's advice mixed in with this advice from Jimbo, so if your engine isn't smoking at all (including start-up) you could say the bores will be ok, but give them a thorough inspection and if ok, then forged rods and suitable shells and standard (original) pistons with fresh rings. Then as Gavin (Merc85) suggests replace the service items, pulleys, water pump, seals etc, and you should have a cracking engine for small money and you know everything should be great for years to come

Yup, looking at it, I think this is pretty much what i'm going to do. If I was looking to really push the boat out on the BHP side of things, i'd go with the rebore and larger pistons, but for a safe and steady all-day-long 320 I think the standard should be fine.

That and it means i'll be able to get it done sooner. Hopefully within the next 12 months for engine, turbo, fmic, suspension, LSD, then onto LPG conversion and saving for paint...

[MoleT-5R]

Yup, looking at it, I think this is pretty much what i'm going to do. If I was looking to really push the boat out on the BHP side of things, i'd go with the rebore and larger pistons, but for a safe and steady all-day-long 320 I think the standard should be fine.

That and it means i'll be able to get it done sooner. Hopefully within the next 12 months for engine, turbo, fmic, suspension, LSD, then onto LPG conversion and saving for paint...

if the advice on the pistons is correct you will be miles inside the safety limit, so still have room to play with when you tire of 320 bhp.....lol