how much can an auto take?

[t5steve]

have read on here that the auto box's don't like modded engines...........my question is how far can you safely mod your engine before your auto box shouts no more................have already got remap/rip/mbc/air filter................have been offered a choice of different turbo's 16t or 18t at a too good to refuse price (ie free ) should i change turbo or stop before box goes bang
as always any help/advice (p##s taking) greatly appreciated
don't bother saying convert to manual as it won't happen

[LiamT4]

First of all, on an auto, the rods will go before the box will (due to the way the gearbox changes gear).

To be honest if i was you i'd take that mbc off, in the last few years of being around the forums i'v known a few autos that have bent there rods with nothing more than a remap and an mbc. I always say auto+mbc=bent rods.

If you fit an extra cooler for the box then it'll be fine with an 18 or 19t, but the mapping will have to be tailered for an auto (i.e very progressive torque map that isn't going for as much torque as possible). I have heard of some maps that also drop the boost when changing gear (remember that autos can do wot gear changes, which is one of the ways you can wreck the box and bend the rods).

A 16t should be fine (without an mbc) and the box will be fine with an 18t (with the cooler), but i think it would simple be a matter of time before the rods went if you went any bigger.

If you really want to go for a genuine 300bhp then, i'm sorry to say, forged rods would be a good idea.

The minimum you should go for when going further than just a simple rempa on an auto are, extra cooler for the box and a map to suit an auto. But if you do want 300bhp then i think you should get stronger rods, which i know you don't want to hear.

I never took my s70r further than a remap, so this is not first hand experience i'm giving you. But this is what i have learned from other peoples experiences , being on the forums and speaking to tuners and auto gearbox specialists.

[LiamT4]

and i know there are plenty of people with around 300bhp on standard rods, but thats with a manual box. You have to be much more carefull with an auto, getting the map perfect is essential on an auto.

[Kingsford G]

Thanx for this question Steve,was gonna make this thread too.My R runs 16t and the same g/box as yrs.I might go for 18t but I thing 16t is still very good and with not much done u can get 280bhp.AndysR runs auto and around 300bhp from what I`ve seen it can do,should`ve asked him at the meet.

[t5steve]

Thanks for info Liam........not chasing 300bhp it was just a thought as I am giving my car a revamp and was offered the turbos
l'm quite happy with cars performance but you know how it is when you are offered something for nothing
I know. it will end in tears......

[LiamT4]

Thanx for this question Steve,was gonna make this thread too.My R runs 16t and the same g/box as yrs.I might go for 18t but I thing 16t is still very good and with not much done u can get 280bhp.AndysR runs auto and around 300bhp from what I`ve seen it can do,should`ve asked him at the meet.

and it wasn't the box that let go on andys car........

[t5steve]

Thanx for this question Steve,was gonna make this thread too.My R runs 16t and the same g/box as yrs.I might go for 18t but I thing 16t is still very good and with not much done u can get 280bhp.AndysR runs auto and around 300bhp from what I`ve seen it can do,should`ve asked him at the meet.

but didn't Andy bend a rod in his...........i was more wondering about what the gearbox could safely take as I have read stories of them going bang in a modded car
Hope I've not opened a can of worms now

[t5steve]

I've gotta learn to type quicker

[LiamT4]

Thanks for info Liam........not chasing 300bhp it was just a thought as I am giving my car a revamp and was offered the turbos
l'm quite happy with cars performance but you know how it is when you are offered something for nothing
I know. it will end in tears......

If you only have 15g on at the minute, then fitting a 16t should be fine. You could go for a 16t, sports cat, good map and a cooler for the box with no issues as the s/v/c70 t5s ran that turbo as standard.

Its when you go further that things get complicated, although getting someone to custom map the 4.3 and 4.4 ecu is tricky enough as it is........then you add the gearbox and it doesn't get any better lol

.......thats why i sold my s70r and got a bmw 540.

[Kingsford G]

but didn't Andy bend a rod in his...........i was more wondering about what the gearbox could safely take as I have read stories of them going bang in a modded car
Hope I've not opened a can of worms now

From what I know Andys car runs a trubo tuner that was set up for his mods and then he bought a 3" intake pipe from Niles if u remember which was a better flow than a standard and that caused the rod bent.His brother Jim has an auto too and 272bhp with no probs as far as I knowI think with and oil cooler and a full atf flush u should be good as long as u not doing a power braking.How much power are u looking for mate?

[Nealevo]

I run a HLM 304 remap and 16t and I was told from the start that fitting a MBC to it will cause me issues, the auto boxes are good but the nature in which they work, i.e in kickdown, they have a tendency to bend the chocolate rods without the correct mapping. Mine runs very well as it is, so I doubt you will have problems.

Just my 2 pence worth

[LiamT4]

you shouldn't even need the extra cooler if you only had a 16t, it depends how you drive.

[Kingsford G]

you shouldn't even need the extra cooler if you only had a 16t, it depends how you drive.

Well if like me a short sprint to every now and again and overtaking I don`t think u need it even mapped.

[LiamT4]

Well if like me a short sprint to every now and again and overtaking I don`t think u need it even mapped.

The mapping depends on the turbo, an off the shelf map will be fine with a 16t. Its when you go further that an auto specific map would be best. They are out there but i can't remember who it was that did them.

The real annoying thing i found when trying to find out how much power the old autos can take is that the ones that did have the box go bang always said how much bhp they had but not how much torque they had. Which helps a bit, but its the torque that kills them.

[ROZER]

i have a s60t5 geartronic it has a 3 inch ferrita dp with full s/s exhaust stage 2 rica when i floor it am only getting 10psi boost in first and second gears as soon as am in third gear shes boosting to 18psi and holds i also think my torque is limited in the first 2 gears aswell when i got it remapped by rica am sure there was an option to remove this. but there is no need my mate has a s60r manual and he thinks mine is faster so it must be round 300bhp. i have done 30k in my geartronic never missed a beat .stay away from mbc on auto that is a no no .

[t5steve]

From what I know Andys car runs a trubo tuner that was set up for his mods and then he bought a 3" intake pipe from Niles if u remember which was a better flow than a standard and that caused the rod bent.His brother Jim has an auto too and 272bhp with no probs as far as I knowI think with and oil cooler and a full atf flush u should be good as long as u not doing a power braking.How much power are u looking for mate?

how much power..................not really looking for any specific power figure.............more a case of being offered turbo's free ...i know they will fit (with/without other mods) but didn't want to wreck my gearbox in the process............as i said i'm quite happy with performance (ok i'm lying......i hate fwd)


I run a HLM 304 remap and 16t and I was told from the start that fitting a MBC to it will cause me issues, the auto boxes are good but the nature in which they work, i.e in kickdown, they have a tendency to bend the chocolate rods without the correct mapping. Mine runs very well as it is, so I doubt you will have problems.
Just my 2 pence worth

think the mbc is destined for the bin.................thanks for this advice fellas




you shouldn't even need the extra cooler if you only had a 16t, it depends how you drive.

how do i drive..............not normally a fruitloop but i have my moments...................is it worth fitting a 16t? is there much difference? should i just leave well alone?

[t5steve]

i have a s60t5 geartronic it has a 3 inch ferrita dp with full s/s exhaust stage 2 rica when i floor it am only getting 10psi boost in first and second gears as soon as am in third gear shes boosting to 18psi and holds i also think my torque is limited in the first 2 gears aswell when i got it remapped by rica am sure there was an option to remove this. but there is no need my mate has a s60r manual and he thinks mine is faster so it must be round 300bhp. i have done 30k in my geartronic never missed a beat .stay away from mbc on auto that is a no no .

my map is also a rica and is similar to yours in that it restricts boost until 3rd gear...................mbc is going in bin................thanks for your info

[LiamT4]

I don't have much experience of a 15g, nealevo would be your best bet there as he went from a 15g to a 16t.

BTW i'v not read or heard of many people that have wrecked the box when running less than 300bhp and of the ones that did, it seems to be because of power starting and you can wreck your box doing that even if your running standard power.

[theflyingbrick]

steve go with the 16t mate...and before people start whinging that theres not much difference,trust me there is,it wont rip your face off but the power band is higher up the rev range so with the 15g you get a little punch from say 2k rpm through to 4 maybe 4.5k rpm then it just dies..with the the 16t it comes in at 2.5k rpm but pulls right through to 5 maybe 5.5k rpm its alot smoother and pulls alot longer its not as vicious as the 15g but it is a decent upgrade.that way you dont have to change your map or anything else just pop it on and off you go :D......................oh and bin the mbc ;)

oh and next time you see my dad have a go of his and youll see what i mean plus the fact he made 284.1 bhp with a few other little bits so if your after more power without going mental than id go with the 16t

[t5steve]

steve go with the 16t mate...and before people start whinging that theres not much difference,trust me there is,it wont rip your face off but the power band is higher up the rev range so with the 15g you get a little punch from say 2k rpm through to 4 maybe 4.5k rpm then it just dies..with the the 16t it comes in at 2.5k rpm but pulls right through to 5 maybe 5.5k rpm its alot smoother and pulls alot longer its not as vicious as the 15g but it is a decent upgrade.that way you dont have to change your map or anything else just pop it on and off you go :D......................oh and bin the mbc ;)

oh and next time you see my dad have a go of his and youll see what i mean plus the fact he made 284.1 bhp with a few other little bits so if your after more power without going mental than id go with the 16t

thanks for that mate..............i think i've made up my mind now.............go with 16t and bin mbc..................

[nottsgreent5]

Ive fitted a 16t stage 2 mte map blues decat snabb intake pipe 3"obx down pipe all with the bcs still in place and it flys boost to 1.3 bar in 2 nd 3rd and 4th and its been running this way for over a year with over 230k on it runs sweet as a nut. my old t5 auto had a rica and a mbc which was great kick down it didnt take alot to bend the rods ie boost spikes when kicking it down to over take from my experience with auto t5s get a decent map and stay clear of mbc's in the long term im sure people will have there opinions that differ from mine lol

[LiamT4]

Ive fitted a 16t stage 2 mte map blues decat snabb intake pipe 3"obx down pipe all with the bcs still in place and it flys boost to 1.3 bar in 2 nd 3rd and 4th and its been running this way for over a year with over 230k on it runs sweet as a nut. my old t5 auto had a rica and a mbc which was great kick down it didnt take alot to bend the rods ie boost spikes when kicking it down to over take from my experience with auto t5s get a decent map and stay clear of mbc's in the long term im sure people will have there opinions that differ from mine lol

Seems that most people have similar opinions.

[Kingsford G]

Ive fitted a 16t stage 2 mte map blues decat snabb intake pipe 3"obx down pipe all with the bcs still in place and it flys boost to 1.3 bar in 2 nd 3rd and 4th and its been running this way for over a year with over 230k on it runs sweet as a nut. my old t5 auto had a rica and a mbc which was great kick down it didnt take alot to bend the rods ie boost spikes when kicking it down to over take from my experience with auto t5s get a decent map and stay clear of mbc's in the long term im sure people will have there opinions that differ from mine lol

Did u fit an oil cooler for the auto box too?

[jotter22]

What is an MBC and what are these rods? i need to know i have an auto!
Tony.

[Kingsford G]

What is an MBC and what are these rods? i need to know i have an auto!
Tony.

Manual boost control that fits instead of electronic one and brings the turbo boost up quick which can result in bent conrods.Conrods are what your pistons sit on.

[LiamT4]

What is an MBC and what are these rods? i need to know i have an auto!
Tony.

manual boost controller. the t5 engine has weak conrods, so if you fit an mbc and turn the boost up, its possibly to bend them, even easier if the car is an auto.

[jotter22]

manual boost controller. the t5 engine has weak conrods, so if you fit an mbc and turn the boost up, its possibly to bend them, even easier if the car is an auto.

Cheers Liam volvo ownership gets better with every passing day....did they throw these cars together out of the parts bin?

Tony.

[LiamT4]

Cheers Liam volvo ownership gets better with every passing day....did they throw these cars together out of the parts bin?

Tony.

lol
as a standard car they are very reliable, i'v had two volvos for two years each and i hope my bmw is as reliable as they were. Its just that when you try to get more power from them, that the rods are weak.

[nottsgreent5]

Did u fit an oil cooler for the auto box too?

No mate just change the box oil every few months keeps it changing nice and smooth lol

[jotter22]

Lol together with the ME7 throttle bod, throttle position sensor, And the MAF seems to comit suicide....and now i have chocolate rods as well!... Its too much to bare :slap:

[LiamT4]

No mate just change the box oil every few months keeps it changing nice and smooth lol

wow, thats pretty often lol

[LiamT4]

Lol together with the ME7 throttle bod, throttle position sensor, And the MAF seems to comit suicide....and now i have chocolate rods as well!... Its too much to bare :slap:

Don't worry, on a standard car with just a remap, you'll have no problems with the rods.

[nottsgreent5]

wow, thats pretty often lol

I work in a plant work shop theres gallons of atf for free lol

[LiamT4]

I work in a plant work shop theres gallons of atf for free lol

Should keep the box healthy anyway lol

[Kingsford G]

I work in a plant work shop theres gallons of atf for free lol

What atf are u using mate.I just done mine with Castrol transmax D3

[nottsgreent5]

Should keep the box healthy anyway lol

Its a pain in the §§§§ to change but worth it lol

[jotter22]

I work in a plant work shop theres gallons of atf for free lol

I didn't think of that i have got machines all over the quarry is it standard ATF or something special?

Tony.

[nottsgreent5]

What atf are u using mate.I just done mine with Castrol transmax D3

Tbh iam not 100% sure its a jcb grade oil but ive run 3 autos on it and its been fine never seems to scorch or discolour i should be able to find the exact grade if your intrested

[nottsgreent5]

I didn't think of that i have got machines all over the quarry is it standard ATF or something special?

Tony.

Jcb grade atf should be able to get the exact specs if your intrested

[Kingsford G]

Tbh iam not 100% sure its a jcb grade oil but ive run 3 autos on it and its been fine never seems to scorch or discolour i should be able to find the exact grade if your intrested

Plz.I was lucky to find a 20L Castrol for £45 `cos it cost £8L

[nottsgreent5]

Plz.I was lucky to find a 20L Castrol for £45 `cos it cost £8L

Thats a good price mate if i get chance tomoz ill get the details for you but bear in mind it mite not be the correct oil its just an oil i use that ive not had any problems with and the cars ive used it on have had no issues with it lol

[jotter22]

Tbh iam not 100% sure its a jcb grade oil but ive run 3 autos on it and its been fine never seems to scorch or discolour i should be able to find the exact grade if your intrested

I meant the grade used in Volvo's....

Tony.