S60R engine in a 850

[oblark]

Does or has anyone fitted a S60R engine in a 850 ??

I no the S60R engine has VVT but the 850 doesn`t so is it a case of not using the VVT ??

[stribo]

TBH if you're just going to use the bottom end, then you'd be better off with a 2.4, as the liners are thicker. Nick MRP's engine whilst he's not looking.;)

[oblark]

TBH if you're just going to use the bottom end, then you'd be better off with a 2.4, as the liners are thicker. Nick MRP's engine whilst he's not looking.;)

The 2.4 engine is the same as the 2.5 the only difference is the 2.4 has a 90mm stroke and the 2.5 has a 93.2mm stroke.

[stribo]

so why do 2.5 liners split and 2.4's don't?

[oblark]

so why do 2.5 liners split and 2.4's don't?

Good question :)

[stribo]

going back to the original question, you do lose some performance without VVT, as we found when ours packed up, butI suppose if you use higher lift cams, or port and polish the head, you may be able to compensate for it.

[smithy]

Good question :)

Heat and I think the 2.4 has thicker sleaves too.put a bigger turbo on the 2.5 no problems .

[claymore]

I have a s60 head on my new engine with the vvt deleted, solid lifters, ported and polishes and fernier adjustable camshafts on a 2.4 s60r bottom end.

[p fandango]

you'll need the middle front engine mount from the picture, can't remember what its off

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy196/pedro-fandango/Volvo/diagrams%20-%20info/fittinganRNengineleftoriginalbodgedmiddleP80-RNperfectrightRNwontfit.jpg

[claymore]

you'll need the middle front engine mount from the picture, can't remember what its off

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy196/pedro-fandango/Volvo/diagrams%20-%20info/fittinganRNengineleftoriginalbodgedmiddleP80-RNperfectrightRNwontfit.jpg

Like this :)

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u258/claymore2k/20130114_155352.jpg

[oblark]

I have a s60 head on my new engine with the vvt deleted, solid lifters, ported and polishes and fernier adjustable camshafts on a 2.4 s60r bottom end.

Why not just put a ported/polished 850 head on a S60R bottom end ??

[p fandango]

i've got one somewhere, but can't remember where i put it lol

[claymore]

Why not just put a ported/polished 850 head on a S60R bottom end ??
Smaller valve stems for one thing, and I assume a better flowing design as it's 10 years more modern than the 850 head.

[oblark]

I was under the impression the valves are the same size on both heads

The only difference was the VVT.

[p fandango]

I was under the impression the valves are the same size on both heads

The only difference was the VVT.
nope

[oblark]

nope

I take it I was wrong then :)

Does the s60r head have bigger valves then ??

[smithy]

They have sliimar valve stems

[smithy]

I put s60r pistons and s60r rods in a 2435 block off a lpt block .

[claymore]

They have sliimar valve stems
Which is what I said :)

[kfc]

why not use the complete engine, and a stand alone ecu? just a thought.

[p fandango]

I have a s60 head on my new engine with the vvt deleted, solid lifters, ported and polishes and fernier adjustable camshafts on a 2.4 s60r bottom end.
what you doing about the dizzy, you going to convert to coil-on-plug or you getting the cams drilled?

[claymore]

what you doing about the dizzy, you going to convert to coil-on-plug or you getting the cams drilled?
Look carefully at the pic of the engine in the back of the mondeo ;)

[p fandango]

Look carefully at the pic of the engine in the back of the mondeo ;)
next you'll be telling me i have to read everything as well lol

[graemewelch]

wouldnt it just be easier to buy a s60 with the 2.4 t5 engine already in. less of a headache

[claymore]

wouldnt it just be easier to buy a s60 with the 2.4 t5 engine already in. less of a headache
But then it wouldn't be an 855

[graemewelch]

But then it wouldn't be an 855

but if want a fast car then just buy a fast one in the first place. lots cheaper and can focus on other mods that help suport high power.

[claymore]

I don't think I could have bought an s60 for £350, and all the money I've spent to my car would probably just get me an average s60 which would be nowhere near as quick as my 855.

[graemewelch]

but what you spent to get it as fast as it is. im not having a dig or anything. ive been there done it and regreted it. said id never mod a car again. that didnt last long though.

[claymore]

but what you spent to get it as fast as it is. im not having a dig or anything. ive been there done it and regreted it. said id never mod a car again. that didnt last long though.

I suppose some people enjoy modifying their cars, while others just want a reasonably fast car to start with, I personally have always modified my cars, I can't remember any time in my driving life i didn't try to make my car go faster, be it a Trabant or a Porsche 911.

[p fandango]

said id never mod a car again. that didnt last long though.
so to throw your own question back at you, why didn't you start with a more powerful/better handling model?

[graemewelch]

cause i thought id didnt want more power than it came with as standard. and i love the build quality and comfort that the s60 has. i hadnt had the car 24 hrs thought and i was looking into building a sports cat and full exhaust. must admit i like to mod cars, not as much as i used to. im more intrested in fabricating one offs these days. the reason i asked the question was cause newer t5 are so selling for next to nothing these days that it could end up cheaper. but i do understand what your saying.

[smithy]

I could say the same thing about my 940 because the was nothing wrong with the car the first time I modded it but I'm always looking on improving the car more and more and making it faster.also it's a learning curve too and I also enjoy fabricating my own stuff ,like a one off car.

[oblark]

So if the only difference between the s60r head and the 850 head is the valve stems then it`s a no brainer to fit the 850 head on a s60r block then you get the best of both worlds.

[claymore]

So if the only difference between the s60r head and the 850 head is the valve stems then it`s a no brainer to fit the 850 head on a s60r block then you get the best of both worlds.

I wouldn't say it was a no brainer, it seems that the big HP 850s are using the post 2005 cylinder head, but it's a lot of work, so for the best compromise I would say 850 head on 2.4 block.

[p fandango]

I wouldn't say it was a no brainer, it seems that the big HP 850s are using the post 2005 cylinder head, but it's a lot of work, so for the best compromise I would say 850 head on 2.4 block.
i agree, certainly wouldn't use a S60R block. I'm already using a ME7 intake manifold so going for a later head, 2.3 block with later crank

[cherry1809]

Thought you could get the liners shimmed to stop the splitting problem?

[oblark]

The 2.4 engine is the same as the 2.5 the only difference is the 2.4 has a 90mm stroke and the 2.5 has a 93.2mm stroke.


I wouldn't say it was a no brainer, it seems that the big HP 850s are using the post 2005 cylinder head, but it's a lot of work, so for the best compromise I would say 850 head on 2.4 block.

As I said at the start of this thread the 2.4 and 2.5 are the same diameter bores but different strokes.


Thought you could get the liners shimmed to stop the splitting problem?

Yes you can get the liners shimmed.

[claymore]

As I said at the start of this thread the 2.4 and 2.5 are the same diameter bores but different strokes.



Yes you can get the liners shimmed.
If the 2.4 and 2.5 are the same, why is the 2.4 engine considered the best for tuning?

[stribo]

If the 2.4 and 2.5 are the same, why is the 2.4 engine considered the best for tuning?

Now that's the million dollar question. ;)

[p fandango]

so is the 2.4 block the same as the S60R, yes its got the same bore but as the stroke is 3mm different is it shorter?

[oblark]

The 2.4 has a 90mm stroke and the 2.5 has a 93.2mm stroke.

[p fandango]

The 2.4 has a 90mm stroke and the 2.5 has a 93.2mm stroke.
3mm as i said (ok i rounded down the 0.2mm lol), but doesn't that mean its a different block

[oblark]

It's either done on the crank or the con rods.

[p fandango]

It's either done on the crank or the con rods.
the 3.2mm less stroke is done via the crank, but what i'm trying to say is it can't really be the same block as the piston moves 3.2mm less is it further away from the top at TDC than a S60R block. Who knows if they thickened the cylinder sleeves while they were losing the 3.2mm

[Dream3r]

bore is 83mm on the s60r and 81mm on the 2.4 IIRC.

[p fandango]

bore is 83mm on the s60r and 81mm on the 2.4 IIRC.
ah just looked thru my engine list, & yes the B5244T5 has thinner bore & longer stroke

B5244S 2435 83 90
B5244S2 2435 83 90
B5244S4 2435 83 90
B5244S5 2435 83 90
B5244S5 2435 83 90
B5244T 2435 83 90
B5244T 2435 83 90
B5244T2 2435 83 90
B5244T3 2435 83 90
B5244T5 2401 81 93.2

[woz]

the 3.2mm less stroke is done via the crank, but ...it can't really be the same block as the piston moves 3.2mm less is it further away from the top at TDC than a S60R block...


Not sure if it is or it isn't but shorter stroke plus longer conrods COULD put the pistons at the same height at TDC. Just a thought...W

[p fandango]

Not sure if it is or it isn't but shorter stroke plus longer conrods COULD put the pistons at the same height at TDC. Just a thought...W
very good point, i've only ever heard of the 139mm or 147mm rods tho. Be certainly cheaper to lengthen the rods than make a different block

[cherry1809]

I have a s60 head on my new engine with the vvt deleted, solid lifters, ported and polishes and fernier adjustable camshafts on a 2.4 s60r bottom end.

So a 2.5 R block (with the right mounts) with an 850 head would go in without too much bother?

[oblark]

So a 2.5 R block (with the right mounts) with an 850 head would go in without too much bother?

Yes :)

[partsforvolvos.com]

i am particularly liking the black pv544 with s60R/2.4T engine in this month's ppc magazine. took the owner 10 years to build but what a great job.

the article might give you some tips about this question.

oblark- are you sure about the 850 head onto a s60 r block? - i thought the r engine was the first on the narrower block , which is think from memory is either 40 or 20mm narrower.

[smithy]

i am particularly liking the black pv544 with s60R/2.4T engine in this month's ppc magazine. took the owner 10 years to build but what a great job.

the article might give you some tips about this question.

oblark- are you sure about the 850 head onto a s60 r block? - i thought the r engine was the first on the narrower block , which is think from memory is either 40 or 20mm narrower.

The s60r block is not narrower that happened when ford wanted to put the engine in the focus and it was too wide.so they narrowed it for that car and then Volvo used it in the s40/v50 because that had a focus platform.

[partsforvolvos.com]

i stand corrected then , but the narrower block is also in the s60/v70/s80 i'm sure- its just the later version. when the s40II came out, they told us on the new model course it was done for crash zone space .
maybe its from when the 2.4t became the 2.5t 2004 / 2005 ish?

smithy - get back to your 900's lol :hidesbehi

[cherry1809]

Hope not, lol.
Good timing on the thread starting up too... Lol.
Having dalhousie's S60R engine off him for mine, as mines well and truely cattled now. Plan is, unless anyone pops up with a spanner for my works - Shim the 2.5R block (might even stick forged rods in while it's in bits) ported 850 head. Anything I don't know about that will stop this?
I did ask Tim Williams and he said it's more hassle than it's worth. :(

[partsforvolvos.com]

Sounds good. Let's see who gets one together first.

[S70T5Chris]

Hope not, lol.
Good timing on the thread starting up too... Lol.
Having dalhousie's S60R engine off him for mine, as mines well and truely cattled now. Plan is, unless anyone pops up with a spanner for my works - Shim the 2.5R block (might even stick forged rods in while it's in bits) ported 850 head. Anything I don't know about that will stop this?
I did ask Tim Williams and he said it's more hassle than it's worth. :(

I would reconsider purchasing anything from Steve. Severe lack of morals, and would do anything and screw anyone over to make a few quid it would seem. I'm just downloading my small claims court forms as we speak...

I wouldn't use the R 2.5 block anyway mate. Seems like a lot of work for no real gain, but if you want to go down that route, use the 2.4 from a late T5. In plentyful supply, and much cheaper. No need to fit liners and no need to fit forged rods either.

[claymore]

I would reconsider purchasing anything from Steve. Severe lack of morals, and would do anything and screw anyone over to make a few quid it would seem. I'm just downloading my small claims court forms as we speak...

I wouldn't use the R 2.5 block anyway mate. Seems like a lot of work for no real gain, but if you want to go down that route, use the 2.4 from a late T5. In plentyful supply, and much cheaper. No need to fit liners and no need to fit forged rods either.

Ohh, that's interesting, is there a thread somewhere?

[claymore]

Sounds good. Let's see who gets one together first.
You mean like this :)


http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u258/claymore2k/20130117_150211-1.jpg

[S70T5Chris]

Ohh, that's interesting, is there a thread somewhere?

Not currently.

[merc85]

I would reconsider purchasing anything from Steve. Severe lack of morals, and would do anything and screw anyone over to make a few quid it would seem. I'm just downloading my small claims court forms as we speak...

I wouldn't use the R 2.5 block anyway mate. Seems like a lot of work for no real gain, but if you want to go down that route, use the 2.4 from a late T5. In plentyful supply, and much cheaper. No need to fit liners and no need to fit forged rods either.

so what year was that chris 2004 onwards??

[merc85]

Rrrrr lol..... found it

[oblark]

Hope not, lol.
Good timing on the thread starting up too... Lol.
Having dalhousie's S60R engine off him for mine, as mines well and truely cattled now. Plan is, unless anyone pops up with a spanner for my works - Shim the 2.5R block (might even stick forged rods in while it's in bits) ported 850 head. Anything I don't know about that will stop this?
I did ask Tim Williams and he said it's more hassle than it's worth. :(

One person idea of "more hassle than it`s worth" is another persons walk in the park.

I would fit a ported 850 head on a low mileage s60r block :)

[smithy]

The s60r 2.5 uses forged rods and pistons as standard that's what I put in my 2435 block and they are strong already.

[merc85]

The B5244t5 lumps rods are man enough, aint they?

[smithy]

The B5244t5 lumps rods are man enough, aint they?

They are supposed to be mate ,I was just saying that the 2.5r rods are forged and so are the pistons .at the time my car was a 2.5t 1997 v70 and I decided to play with that engine abit instead of just throwing a t5 lump in it.and it went very well mate .