The best brake set up ??

[8501970]

I have been looking for the ultimate set up for my volvo 850 whats the biggest and best set up i have seen a few people run the S60R rear brembos but what is being done about the brake imbalence ?

[Mongo]

I have the 48vane ap kit on mine 330 discs 4pot calipers and full race ebc bluestuff ndx pads brilliant setup stop on a 5p i done nurburgring without any brake fade bit pricey tho think there on ebay still around £1500 ive just got standard brakes on the back.

[AndysR]

As above, don't think you can do better than the AP's upgrading the rears with AP's already fitted to the front would probably only be for looks as I doubt you acheive any noticeable performance gains.

[Al115]

A lot of people don't think about the brake imbalance and just go ahead and fit huge fronts - I don't know the answer but it's definitely worth looking into carefully.

AP fronts are rumoured to be good, you can fit Porsche "Big reds" to the fronts as well, really you want to know the corner weights of the car before working out the brake setup I would think.

[T4Rick]

If using the porshe big red set up what discs do you use is it the xc60 or something?

[8501970]

Thanks for the replys i was more wondering how people with the v large rears are getting round the problem of not being able to adjust the brake bias on a standard set up .

have seen a few cars with the porsche set up why an earth you would fit those unless you have upgraded your master cylinder is a dangerous game to play with your life !

[Al115]

Why on earth would you make DIY brake upgrades yourself without doing the maths and working out the whole setup - or going to a garage you trust and having them do it? :)

Key bits of the car really.

[Yosser]

I have the 48vane ap kit on mine 330 discs 4pot calipers and full race ebc bluestuff ndx pads brilliant setup stop on a 5p i done nurburgring without any brake fade bit pricey tho think there on ebay still around £1500 ive just got standard brakes on the back.

So you rate the bluestuff then?

I'm currently running yellowstuff in my AP calipers but feel they could probably be better.

[Wobbly Dave]

Best fast road pads - Ferodo DS2500. No need to change calipers then!

[JezF]

Also Pagid RS range (have 14's on the Eise) or Carbon Lorraines.

[Flatout Phil]

In my dreams the AP would be good. It all depends how far you want to go. The conclusion I have come to is that for road use, 302s are the best real-world solution - cheap, easy to maintain (unlike AP!), and work well with the rears. As Dave says, stick a decent pad in and all is good - although TBH the standard Volvo ones are pretty adequate - nothing like needing to brake hard on cold flashy pads! You might as well stick to 280 discs in those circumstances! :P

[JezF]

I've been told by more than one person that 302's are a total waste of money unless you track your car.

As I've had red Brembo's before and driven cars with AP's, I'd say AP's all day long - their stopping power is absolutely immense. Horribly expensive to replace disks mind you.

[Flatout Phil]

I've been told by more than one person that 302's are a total waste of money unless you track your car.

As I've had red Brembo's before and driven cars with AP's, I'd say AP's all day long - their stopping power is absolutely immense. Horribly expensive to replace disks mind you.

302s are what were fitted to V70 T5 as standard, and can easily be retrofitted to 850 so long as you don't use Columba alloys (most other 16" plus are fine). Only costs about £200 to do whole conversion and for road use makes a world of difference - first thing I did to the R, having owned a T5 before, and WELL worth it. The history of the 302 is that the Police insisted on improved brakes for the T5 because the 280 was a fairly marginal brake even before it got hot. The 330 on the AP are, perhaps, somewhat excessive for day to day use. But hey, if you can afford them, fit them...:)

[JezF]

I know the history, but like I said more than one unrelated person has said don't waste your money and these are people who are well respected on forums and have a lot of knowledge/experience so I'd trust them. I was intending to go for 302's, but just fitted a full set of OEM Volvo ones and they have been very good tbh - all road miles though.

[Flatout Phil]

I know the history, but like I said more than one unrelated person has said don't waste your money and these are people who are well respected on forums and have a lot of knowledge/experience so I'd trust them. I was intending to go for 302's, but just fitted a full set of OEM Volvo ones and they have been very good tbh - all road miles though.

302 are OEM on V70 T5... Just uses the v70 bracket and disc but standard calliper - it's a one hour job and reduces brake fade and increases stopping considerably...it's in the physics ;)

[Al115]

I've been told by more than one person that 302's are a total waste of money unless you track your car.

Total ££££££££. Sorry, but it is! :)

Though I guess it depends very much on your driving style... and where you live... and...

[t5_monkey]

Mine runs 302mm and a few people upgrade to the Focus ST 320mm ones (some S40 T5's came with them, some not for some strange reason.)

320mm is enough to not fade on the track.

[S70T5Chris]

It's not until you drive a P1 with a 'brake upgrade' (such as AP, Porsche, WP Pro, etc etc) that you really see how naff the standard brakes are, be that 280's/302's/volvo pads/ferodo pads/or whatever.

And on a track the standard brakes are just utterly useless IMHO.

[Al115]

Agreed!

One thing that never gets mentioned, so I thought I'd pitch it in - be sure that the calipers you choose are suitable for road use. Everyone assumes "oh yeah, if they are track calipers they will be more than good enough for the road"... nope. Track calipers a) get properly hot regularly, and b) don't have to put up with road salt, dirt and grit and cack - and for these reasons they often don't have much in the way of seals / protection. I have had a set of "big brakes" fail after a SINGLE winter on a road car.

Brembos / Big Reds would be my choice if I went round again, for that reason. Not sure how the APs would fare, I don't know much about them.

Oh, and the same track vs road distinction applies for pads. Get "fast road" pads and nothing faster, and you should avoid that "first thing in the morning and I can't stop 'cos the brakes are cold" moment"! But you probably know that.

[JezF]

Total ££££££££. Sorry, but it is! :)

Though I guess it depends very much on your driving style... and where you live... and...

Fair enough but both those people have experience of the 302 upgrade and of more powerful upgrades and in their view it doesn't make a lot of difference. I don't have experience of them so totally accept mine's. third party view; I just just sought their opinion when mine needed replacing. Totally agree re driving style though as I'm fairly light on brakes compared to some and also my car's only lightly modified and an auto so slower anyway.

[t5_monkey]

A Custom brake upgrade will always be miles ahead of something fitted as standard.

[Al115]

Fair enough but both those people have experience of the 302 upgrade and of more powerful upgrades and in their view it doesn't make a lot of difference. I don't have experience of them so totally accept mine's. third party view; I just just sought their opinion when mine needed replacing. Totally agree re driving style though as I'm fairly light on brakes compared to some and also my car's only lightly modified and an auto so slower anyway.

I know that the 302s pale in comparison with the larger setups, so that makes sense. And always good to ask around for opinions - I would have saved some money if I'd done that! I've had standard brakes "aged" - standard brakes all replaced "new" - 302s with Mintex - 302s with Ferodo pads - Hi-Specs - Brembos - Evo 3 calipers (on a T4) - a whole range of stuff.

To be honest the main factor is your driving style. If you are not ragging the car into every corner, and if you brake smoothly, and don't live in the Dales or Milton Keynes, then my personal view is that I would put on 302s with Ferodos, check no calipers were seized (you'd be amazed), change the fluid, check the rears over, and be done with it.

Everyone's entitled to their own views, that's the beauty of modifying.

[BlackBeast]

302s are what were fitted to V70 T5 as standard, . The 330 on the AP are, perhaps, somewhat excessive for day to day use. But hey, if you can afford them, fit them...:)

First of all, 302mm were not fitted to all V70 T5 as standard. Second of all, the AP kit for 850/x70 cars have 325mm rotors.

Back in the day my V70 T5 came with the 280mm setup, I changed to the Porsche/S60R setup and used standard Textar pads. The suspension didn't cope too well as the car would nose dive. Next was to fit the S60R rear brake setup and it was back to a level braking experience. Since then, I have used Carbotech XP8s on the front and the braking experience has shifted up to another level. Next is to try the XP8s (thanks Dooby) on the rear as up until now its only ever had standard S60R pads.

I do have the 302mm setup on the V70 TDI with genuine discs/pads due to towing. Even the g/f stated that the brakes were leagues ahead on the T5 (with the textar pads) compared to her TDI setup.

[Yosser]

First of all, 302mm were not fitted to all V70 T5 as standard. Second of all, the AP kit for 850/x70 cars have 325mm rotors.



You're half right there Steve.

Right enough that not all v70 t5's had 302s as standard (my own had 280s from the factory), but AP brakes did come in 330mm - in fact thats whats fitted to my car at present.

[8501970]

First of all, 302mm were not fitted to all V70 T5 as standard. Second of all, the AP kit for 850/x70 cars have 325mm rotors.

Back in the day my V70 T5 came with the 280mm setup, I changed to the Porsche/S60R setup and used standard Textar pads. The suspension didn't cope too well as the car would nose dive. Next was to fit the S60R rear brake setup and it was back to a level braking experience. Since then, I have used Carbotech XP8s on the front and the braking experience has shifted up to another level. Next is to try the XP8s (thanks Dooby) on the rear as up until now its only ever had standard S60R pads.

I do have the 302mm setup on the V70 TDI with genuine discs/pads due to towing. Even the g/f stated that the brakes were leagues ahead on the T5 (with the textar pads) compared to her TDI setup.

Never mind any of that your one of the people with S60R rears how did you adjust your brake bias and also did you work out what size master cylinder to use with porsche calipers designed for a porsche not a volvo ??????

[Al115]

I'd venture that the reason you haven't had any straight answer yet is that pretty much no-one has a) adjusted the brake bias, or b) done much thinking about the master cylinder.

Brake upgrade kits are sold as "bolt on" and so that's where most people stop I think.

[BlackBeast]

You're half right there Steve.

Right enough that not all v70 t5's had 302s as standard (my own had 280s from the factory), but AP brakes did come in 330mm - in fact thats whats fitted to my car at present.

Hi Nick, that's strange, looking at the AP Racing website they have 325mm rotors for the 850 and 330mm rotors for the x70, yet they have the same part number. I was always under the assumption that they were 325mm. Happy to be proved incorrect :)

[Volvostorm]

I'm fairly sure mine are 325mm, I will go check this week

[BlackBeast]

Never mind any of that your one of the people with S60R rears how did you adjust your brake bias and also did you work out what size master cylinder to use with porsche calipers designed for a porsche not a volvo ??????

I adjusted the brake bias by fitting the S60R rear brake setup :)

In all seriousness, I have not adjusted the brake bias and I use the standard master cylinder.

[8501970]

I adjusted the brake bias by fitting the S60R rear brake setup :)

In all seriousness, I have not adjusted the brake bias and I use the standard master cylinder.

Well done you have made your car more powerful and gave your brakes the least amount of thought :wallbash:

[S70T5Chris]

Well done you have made your car more powerful and gave your brakes the least amount of thought :wallbash:

You're kidding aren't you? You have all these people running 280, 290, 300+ bhp all over the forums, with standard brakes (which are £££££e, whether they choose to see it or not), and you're knocking the guy who's spent £££ on a brembo setup.

Porsche 993tt calipers on the front, utilizing S60R discs and S60R(brembo) rears are a tried and tested upgrade, done hundreds of times on the P1 Volvos, all over world of Volvo enthusiasts.

I have the same setup, and have done countless track days. There is no comparison what so ever with the factory brake set up.

Least amount of thought??? You just want and argument by the sounds of it.

[BlackBeast]

Well done you have made your car more powerful and gave your brakes the least amount of thought :wallbash:

Have I made my car more powerful?

I used a proven method of uprating my brakes, granted I was one of the first in the UK to do it though. Sorry to disappoint you but it just so happens that the T5 master cylinder works perfectly well with 4pots all round. Passes the MOT year on year and they are absolutely fantastic on track.

[LiamT4]

You have to remember that a lot of people who have done these brake upgrades do a fair amount of trackdays, so they have first hand experience of what works.

[AndysR]

Well done you have made your car more powerful and gave your brakes the least amount of thought :wallbash:

It's worth mentioning that the AP BBK is designed as a direct bolt on upgrade and to utilise the standard master cylinder so no thought is required after that. The improvement to braking performance with the AP brakes and standard Volvo rears, having driven one, is very noticeable compared to mine which is running 302's with the Ferrodo pads upgrade (probably the mostly commonly used upgrade). I would have thought that by fitting the S60R rear brake caliper setup, in conjunction with the AP's, won't adversely affect the braking bias, in fact if anything I'd have thought it would have taken the bias closer to the way it would have been standard due to the increased braking performance that the AP's provide. As already stated the scariest fact when talking about brakes on Volvo's is the number of people who modifiy their car's without even considering a brake fluid change let alone worring about changing the standard setup with 280mm fronts...

[BlackBeast]

You're kidding aren't you? You have all these people running 280, 290, 300+ bhp all over the forums, with standard brakes (which are £££££e, whether they choose to see it or not), and you're knocking the guy who's spent £££ on a brembo setup.

Porsche 993tt calipers on the front, utilizing S60R discs and S60R(brembo) rears are a tried and tested upgrade, done hundreds of times on the P1 Volvos, all over world of Volvo enthusiasts.

I have the same setup, and have done countless track days. There is no comparison what so ever with the factory brake set up.

Least amount of thought??? You just want and argument by the sounds of it.

Thanks English, love what you've done with your car, especially the lack of thought to the brake setup LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

[S70T5Chris]

Thanks English, love what you've done with your car, especially the lack of thought to the brake setup LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

That's alright Welsh. Your car is alright too I suppose, despite the lack of thought that has gone into your brakes. :wallbash:

[Redbrick]

T5 now running 330mm slotted AP discs and S60R rears running Carbotech XP8's all round. Using RB600 brake fluid.

Like a sheep I just went the tried and tested route. lol

Brakes hard and utterly no dive, 'kin love it! :)

[jardon]

My contribution. Fast road use and I got fade with Volvo pads so fitted ferodo DS2500 up front. More fade resistance but unnervingly variable pedal feel depending on temperature. Also wooden pedal feel even if braking was good. Worked on track for half a day but the heat finally cooked them - pad pick up and judder for the next 500 miles. Now running carbotechs front and rear - xp10/xp8. Incomparable performance on road whether cold or hot - great pedal feel and easy to modulate. They are better than stock from cold and I can still remember smiling as they warmed up - braking force like I'd never experienced before. On track they seemed unbreakable and no pick up. The downside is noise - it really can be spectacular and will annoy some folk. They wear well but are harder on discs than stock or DS2500s. I accept that as I am using stock disks and Calipers they will never stand up to track abuse like a quality bbk but the stock kit can be made to perform very well indeed. I have removed front and rear dust shields to increase cooling.

As has been said already it does depend on your driving style as to how far you go in upgrading brakes and whether track use is likely. I like the look of a bbk but can't justify the cost in a 99% road use application when cheap stock kit works so well. If I had more track use planned I would look at an AP kit as they fit under 17" wheels I think.