Handling

[Giles]

as title suggests ........ is it possible to go round a corner in a Volvo?

As silly and pissed as it sounds, I 'raced' my mate in his Renault Megane Sport and the only thing that let me down was roundabouts and slight bends at 100mph ....... the car was swaying like crazy lol

[t5 pete]

any thing is possible it totally depends on your budget it could either be sports suspension with lowering springs, coilovers, uprated sway bars etc

[Giles]

any thing is possible it totally depends on your budget it could either be sports suspension with lowering springs, coilovers, uprated sway bars etc

ok - the point of the question was handling - and by the answer, it suggests that it's a 'no' standard, suggesting uprating the car in order to achieve it ..... ? It was a 2009 model and mine was a 1996 model tho .....

[Giles]

ok - the point of the question was handling - and by the answer, it suggests that it's a 'no' standard, suggesting uprating the car in order to achieve it ..... ? It was a 2009 model and mine was a 1996 model tho .....

that sounded like a rude response - wasn't meant to be ..... just saying that in order to compete with today's new cars, uprating is required and that 1996 models seem to lack the technology of today's cars ...... plus, volvo's aren't meant to handle ...... i have a picture of a BTCC car almost on it's roof

[Giles]

here

[p fandango]

here
thats tame compared to Tarquini effort in the Alfa. I don't normally drive that fast but always got on quite well with the Volvo's handling, always been very predictable even when pushed past its limits. Going against a lightweight hatch 10years younger with sports suspension from the factory isn't going to be in the Volvo's favour tho

http://ll.speedhunters.com/u/f/eagames/NFS/speedhunters.com/Images/AndyBlackmore/BTCC/st/btcc_94_tarq.jpg

[Giles]

suppose not lol ..... he said he slowed down when he saw me almost flipping .... yeah right, i caught him ;)

[t5_monkey]

Mines Handles... but it is effectively a Focus ST on eibach springs and Bilstein B8 dampers :)

The Megane is well known for handling like a house fly on **** tho... even better than the Focus RS.2 according to the reviews.

[Giles]

Mines Handles... but it is effectively a Focus ST on eibach springs and Bilstein B8 dampers :)

The Megane is well known for handling like a house fly on **** tho... even better than the Focus RS.2 according to the reviews.

I have eibach & FSD (whatever this means) suspension ...... suppose i stood no chance against the megane then lol

[t5_monkey]

I have eibach & FSD (whatever this means) suspension ...... suppose i stood no chance against the megane then lol

Well a megane would still be better... and The chassis tech in the 855 is a generation (or two!) behind the P.2 S40/V50 platform which still isn't as good as the Megane, even on a good day with all the Focus RS bits :D

on the upside... yours wont disintegrate spontaneously when it hits 5 years old! Bloody French build quality :o

[turbo-tuner]

as title suggests ........ is it possible to go round a corner in a Volvo?


It certainly is possible! My V60 R-Design loves corners. Handling is great, straight from the factory.

[p fandango]

It certainly is possible! My V60 R-Design loves corners. Handling is great, straight from the factory.
must agree, the S60 i drove on the Naughty trackday was lightyears ahead of any other Volvo i've been in

[JUDGENINJA]

I suppose it all depends on what you want. To improve handling is a bit if a compromise.

Improve a cars handling for a smooth track which would involve seem welding up the shell, rollcages, suspension.... The list goes on.. But the car would then would be useless on a open undulating A road.

My point relates to a comparison between my friends 300+Bhp Nissan skyline and my 200bhp Volvo. We both took off together down a stretch of dual carriage way. The skyline went about 50metres in front as we accelerated.
My car then smoothly caught up as I noticed that the Skyline was jumping all over the place.... I hardly noticed the bumps at 14*mph.. He had to bail at 12*mph..

A bit of the tale of the tortoise and the hare...

[leet5r]

av hasseled loads of cars including a 54plate wrx

[t5_monkey]

av hasseled loads of cars including a 54plate wrx

WRX... They do turn into tin slugs above 60mph to be fair :)

[leet5r]

good job we only went to 70mph

[cherry1809]

I went in st5ve's 850R when I went to look at mine, And it went round corners just fine. Ride was still nice too, Not too firm and not too soft.
Think from memory he had Koni's and IPD roll bars. They're on my shopping list anyways.

[Santa]

must agree, the S60 i drove on the Naughty trackday was lightyears ahead of any other Volvo i've been in

I have to also agree that sheer handling of the new S60 is better than the last gen S60R. (Probably have more grip in the S60R but the new active chassis pisses all over the old one).

[Giles]

I have to say I had issues at 90mph round a light bend ....... car swayed a bit but maybe my suspension was iffy.....the other issue I had was a small roundabout.....car kinda 'bounced' round but I was going about 30-40mph and it was a small roundabout ....

[JUDGENINJA]

Your always going to suffer with under steer.. This is just the nature of our forward mounted engines..

[turbo-tuner]

Your always going to suffer with under steer.. This is just the nature of our forward mounted engines..

I disagree - have a go in the new S60/V60 R-Design.

[p fandango]

perhaps its how i drive but BT's back always comes out first on corners, lift-off oversteer anyone :sinner:

[JUDGENINJA]

I disagree - have a go in the new S60/V60 R-Design.

OK... But we're talking in the 850 section..

[turbo-tuner]

OK... But we're talking in the 850 section..

Yes, but all Volvo cars have the engine in the front, not just the 850. Therefore the statement that the understeer is as a result of the engine position isn't necessarily true.

[JUDGENINJA]

OK I will just have to take your word against the world of simple physics....place all of the weight forwards in front of the the front wheels and it causes untold amounts of issues for handling. It is only software and technologies that will limit understeer..

Volvo must have cracked it then... High performance Audis all report understeer, VW's all report understeer. even these reports state understeer.

http://www.swedespeed.com/artman2/publish/Reviews_and_Road_Tests/First_Drive_2011_Volvo_S60_T6_AWD_1825.html

http://www.drivingsports.com/site/2010/09/test-drive-volvo-s60-maybe-naughty-certainly-nice/

One more thing 850 isn't four wheel drive...

[Giles]

One more thing 850 isn't four wheel drive...

Thank God ..... just look at all the V70 AWD's converted to 2WD ..... DPA told me it's £1,800 to fix it when it goes wrong, then another £1,200 for the part the £1,800 part has shredded with it ..... then labour ........

Perhaps we should combine Subaru driveshaft technology with Volvo performance .....?

[t5_monkey]

The S60 T6 felt nose heavy when I drove it (OK so i may been driving badly!) but you definitely got that sensation.

[turbo-tuner]

OK I will just have to take your word against the world of simple physics....place all of the weight forwards in front of the the front wheels and it causes untold amounts of issues for handling. It is only software and technologies that will limit understeer..

Volvo must have cracked it then... High performance Audis all report understeer, VW's all report understeer. even these reports state understeer.

http://www.swedespeed.com/artman2/publish/Reviews_and_Road_Tests/First_Drive_2011_Volvo_S60_T6_AWD_1825.html

http://www.drivingsports.com/site/2010/09/test-drive-volvo-s60-maybe-naughty-certainly-nice/

One more thing 850 isn't four wheel drive...

My V60 is FWD. The links you posted are for the standard car, not the R-Design model. I understand what you're saying and the physics is simple enough. Nevertheless, Volvo has done an extremely good job of limiting the understeer using suspension technology and clever electronics. Don't take my word for it - have a drive in a S60/V60 R-Design and see for yourself - I think you'll be pleasantly surprised to see just how capable it is in the corners.

[Ade]

I'm going to be in Germany at the end of the month..... would be rude not to have a blast on the Ring. The budget only really is going to stretch to lowered springs though. Think this will make enough of a difference? Proper boaty just now! :lol:

[p fandango]

I'm going to be in Germany at the end of the month..... would be rude not to have a blast on the Ring. The budget only really is going to stretch to lowered springs though. Think this will make enough of a difference? Proper boaty just now! :lol:
they should certainly improve it enough to notice, have you got a strut brace?

[Dangerous Dave]

One more thing 850 isn't four wheel drive...
Mine is (sort of)


Thank God ..... just look at all the V70 AWD's converted to 2WD ..... DPA told me it's £1,800 to fix it when it goes wrong, then another £1,200 for the part the £1,800 part has shredded with it ..... then labour ........
Depends on how the cars were looked after, some people treat them like crap and moan when they break down, other people don't maintain them as the manual states (i.e. tyre wear differences stressing the awd system). My dads AWD (according to its history) had a new clutch and flywheel after they were destroyed by the car's disabled driver.

I treat mine pretty badly, and it doesn't hesitate to pay me back in some mechanical way, but its still running on its original drivetrain components (apart from the connecting sleeve)

[t5_monkey]

I'm going to be in Germany at the end of the month..... would be rude not to have a blast on the Ring. The budget only really is going to stretch to lowered springs though. Think this will make enough of a difference? Proper boaty just now! :lol:

Strut Brace and thicker role bars will help too :)

[Wobbly Dave]

My car is exceptionally good in the corners. I have spent a small fortune on getting the best of the FWD.

strut brace - blistein B3 - decent springs (Eibach) - stiffer ARBs - LSD - wider tyres.

How fast do you want to go round a corner???

[Ade]

they should certainly improve it enough to notice, have you got a strut brace?


Nope! Anyone sell me a cheap one?
They make much difference?

[t5_monkey]

Nope! Anyone sell me a cheap one?
They make much difference?

Made a massive difference on my S40 - and that's a stiffer NCAP 5 car than the 850's - so by all accounts.. hell yes !

A Polybush will help with engine movement, and the Rollbars will probably make the biggest difference.

[JUDGENINJA]

With just a strutbrace You still ain't going to out manoeuvre a Megane..

[t5_monkey]

With just a strutbrace You still ain't going to out manoeuvre a Megane..

You'd need an Evo or a Lotus Elise for that!

[lance]

The 850R offered good handling in 1996 against its competition but the ride was hard, I found the handling predictable on the limit but having driven the newer 2010 volvos S60 my current V50 Focus I have to say the handling on the new Volvos is light years ahead, apart from getting the power down my V50 corners and handles better than My 2000 Audi S4 which was on ebach lowering springs. I have to say the new S60 was very impresive but I am biasad because I havent driven many newer alternatives. I can only compare with older S60/ V70s Current V50 T5, skoda Octavia VRS Mk2, Saab 9-5 Hot and Focus St. The Saab being the worst the Skoda being the hardest ride the Focus and the V50 being the most nimble feeling and the latest S60 the best overall.

[turbo-tuner]

apart from getting the power down my V50 corners and handles better than My 2000 Audi S4 which was on ebach lowering springs.

This is where the new S60/V60 is a big improvement over previous Volvos, because you can actually get the power down when cornering hard, even with only FWD. The clever electronics apply braking to the inside wheel when cornering, which sends more power to the outside wheel where most of the grip is, and also helps to pull the car round.

You can brake hard in a corner and the DSTC system keeps the back end from stepping out. The car feels rock steady in all situations, whether low or high speed. You can throw it around and really enjoy the drive on the twisty bits! :)

[lance]

Stop it Adam! I would love a V60 R design D5 manual.





I just cant / won't afford one right now

[wegal]

My P2 S60 handles just fine, I have the 4C chassis and this applys brakes to the wheels individually to make sure it goes around the corners, you can feel it working and it feels weird at first, but understeer is almost non existant. You get a tiny initial amount and then the car settles, if you continue to push then you end up in a very predictable 4 wheel slide. I dont know how the new system ( if it is new) can be any better than the 4C I have on mine. Put simply it works, both on the track and on the road. On the track I push the system deliberately on the road a few other stupid drivers have caused me to test the understeer levels.

Wet motorway 70mph having to swerve so that Im pointing at the central reservation at 45 degrees, correct the steering expecting to understeer into the armco.. nope feel the rear end settle car goes straight and points in the exact direction I ask it to. Volvo sorted the handling years ago, it just cost a hell of a lot of money to have it fitted to the T5.

For an 850 id say see how old the current suspension is, it maybe worn out anyway, if its got more than 60k on the shocks then they will be shot at the limit. Stiffer anti roll bars will sort body roll and reduce weight transfer. You may find putting ordinary shocks on the car and stiffer anti roll bars will give you what you. <Lowering and uprating can spoil the everyday ride of the car.

[turbo-tuner]

My P2 S60 handles just fine, I have the 4C chassis and this applys brakes to the wheels individually to make sure it goes around the corners, you can feel it working and it feels weird at first, but understeer is almost non existant. You get a tiny initial amount and then the car settles, if you continue to push then you end up in a very predictable 4 wheel slide. I dont know how the new system ( if it is new) can be any better than the 4C I have on mine. Put simply it works, both on the track and on the road. On the track I push the system deliberately on the road a few other stupid drivers have caused me to test the understeer levels.

Wet motorway 70mph having to swerve so that Im pointing at the central reservation at 45 degrees, correct the steering expecting to understeer into the armco.. nope feel the rear end settle car goes straight and points in the exact direction I ask it to. Volvo sorted the handling years ago, it just cost a hell of a lot of money to have it fitted to the T5.

For an 850 id say see how old the current suspension is, it maybe worn out anyway, if its got more than 60k on the shocks then they will be shot at the limit. Stiffer anti roll bars will sort body roll and reduce weight transfer. You may find putting ordinary shocks on the car and stiffer anti roll bars will give you what you. <Lowering and uprating can spoil the everyday ride of the car.

What's interesting is that the S60/V60 R-Design models don't have 4C (it's not even an option), yet they handle better than the 4C equipped standard non-R-Design models. Therefore it must be the uprated physical suspension setup combined with the Corner-Traction system and DSTC that gives the R-Design models the improved cornering capability. Perhaps Volvo also use a specific 4C mode for the R-Design which cannot be adjusted.

[Flatout Phil]

Well it's never going to handle like a lightweight, but mine handles pretty well for a big car.
Standard R springs. Rear Nivomats. IPD front and rear anti roll bars. Standard Volvo supplied droplinks. Front shocks Bilstein B4 (about £50 each from Eurocarparts). New Volvo supplied lower front arms. All bushes in good nick. Front strut brace.
Titans with 215/40/17 Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas.

4 wheel laser alignment! Really important for handling - but don't set it up until you have decided on ARB and springs!

The ride is tight, level and firm but not brain loosening - won't shatter your spine (or your wallet).

I am sure others will venture opinions but it works for me.

One thing with IPD ARBs is not to overdo the springs - because they will cause the car to feel much more rigid anyway. Overdo the springs and you will have car that rides like a 1.5 ton skateboard!

[Flatout Phil]

that sounded like a rude response - wasn't meant to be ..... just saying that in order to compete with today's new cars, uprating is required and that 1996 models seem to lack the technology of today's cars ...... plus, volvo's aren't meant to handle ...... i have a picture of a BTCC car almost on it's roof

Horses for courses. 850 were long-legged executive cruisers, not hot-hatches - so they can never be what they are not. And the design is twenty years old. Jump back twenty years further and look what was being launched in the early seventies. It is a car of it's time, and thankfully, developments make newer cars generally much better. The 850 R was always a disappointment when it came to ride compared to Merc and BMW when it was launched.
Driving the wife's 1999 Golf convertible (!), I can say that that car has huge handling potential, and rides the bumps better. But a Volvo it is not.
So don't feel the urge to have it as something it isn't and enjoy it for what it is ;)

[Santa]

I'm waiting for it to come in 150MPG 280BHP AWD Diesel Hybrid form. (2013 apparently).

[t5_monkey]

I'm waiting for it to come in 150MPG 280BHP AWD Diesel Hybrid form. (2013 apparently).

Take out a zero and mines not far off :)

[Wobbly Dave]

I'm waiting for it to come in 150MPG 280BHP AWD Diesel Hybrid form. (2013 apparently).
Me too!!

[Giles]

I'm waiting for it to come in 150MPG 280BHP AWD Diesel Hybrid form. (2013 apparently).

I'd rather buy a 12mpg M5 for £6,000 than spend £40,000 on a car that does 150mpg ..... savings dont add up - I have had this 'argument' with people many times...... "ooh, my BMW 120D does 63mpg....." yeah but it cost you £20,000 and has lost more in depreciation than I have spent on fuel in my 850R .......

[lance]

Exatcly why on a smaller scale I chose the V50 T5 over a V50 D5 or a Audi A4 3.0 TDI. Both diesels cost £8-10 k verses under £5k for the T5 ok they were slighty newer but even so there isnt that much in it fuel wise in the real world