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woz
Wednesday 4th August 2010, 15:19
Having always used VPower or other 99RON fuel ever since my RICA upgrade, and with forays into 95 RON petrol being met with fluffing and misfires under full boost, I thought I would give the new Shell Fuelsaver a try. Cynicaly I thought it woud be just a marketing mix, with punters unable to prove or disprove their claims of improved economy.

Amazingly I found it smoother than any other non-99 RON fuel, no significant misfire and only a marginal decrease in power from running on VPower. In fact I did not notice the difference until I switched back to VPower today!!. So for 113.9p vs 120.9p per litre I reckon its worth a try.

My belief is that the normal misfire under boost on low RON fuel is due to the ECU retarding the ignition when it detects knock. I may be wrong (any ideas anyone). Therefore it seems that using Fuelsaver may not be putting the engine in the knock zone even under boost so is better for the engine too??

Anyway on a steady run when I am not going to be booting it too hard I shall be happy to stick Feuelsaver in my beasty from here on, but use VPower for the more "enjoyable" trips.

Anyone have any evidence for or against??

Cheers

Woz.

princepugh
Wednesday 4th August 2010, 17:25
I've been thinking about trying this since it was launched a couple of weeks back but didn't really want to go 95 RON for the reasons you state.

Think it warrants some back to back 'trundle' tests to justify its usage for non-performance runs to see if the costs do actually translate compared to V-power.

At the end of the day though, it's still 95 RON so you'll be in the knock zone if you're running an optimized map.

woz
Thursday 5th August 2010, 18:22
Think it warrants some back to back 'trundle' tests to justify its usage for non-performance runs to see if the costs do actually translate compared to V-power.

At the end of the day though, it's still 95 RON so you'll be in the knock zone if you're running an optimized map.

Give it a go see what you think. The ECU is pretty good at working arond any detectable knock. I did a "trundle" down to Southampton a couple of times - 200m round trip. Amazed me. Usually I have to keep my foot off the floor unless running a 99 RON.

This stuff worked fine. Report back when you have tried it.

WOZ

princepugh
Thursday 5th August 2010, 18:42
Heading up to Scottyland this weekend so may try a tankfull on the trip - apparently it has the same friction modifier and concentration of cleansing additives as Vpower, which gives plausible reasoning behind the MPG claim.

RollingThunder
Sunday 8th August 2010, 10:55
I'm a Vpower addict too, but the price difference is getting a bit much lately - 7p/litre as mentioned ^^^ around here.

Its looking like I'll have a round trip to Cardiff (from Doncaster) in a bit, so I'll give this new stuff a go and see what happens. I should have a few weeks on the HLM302 map by then too so the comparison will be interesting.

The Flying Moose
Sunday 8th August 2010, 11:02
I have used it, and Im affriad I cant comment on the map front as mine is standard but it seems to be an good enough fuel, definately smooth although unless it gets extremely expensive Ill stick to V-Power only 117.9p in Lincoln.

One thing I must say is in the T5 it doesnt seem to save my promised 1L of fuel or around 5 miles extra per tank!

RollingThunder
Sunday 8th August 2010, 20:22
One thing I must say is in the T5 it doesnt seem to save my promised 1L of fuel or around 5 miles extra per tank!

I usually get about 30-40 miles extra on a tank of Vpower compared to the std stuff, so if you were running Vpower anyway, that might account for the lack of improvement? Just a thought... :)

The Flying Moose
Monday 9th August 2010, 00:02
I usually get about 30-40 miles extra on a tank of Vpower compared to the std stuff, so if you were running Vpower anyway, that might account for the lack of improvement? Just a thought... :)

I hadnt thought of that... sometimes the simple things are easy to miss!

scr8pdo
Thursday 12th August 2010, 09:39
I always use Vpower if i can, Shell garage about a mile from me or if not I will try to always use the higher octane, BP Ultimate, Total Exellium, Esso Super plus etc, I have tried this and will definatly get more mpg on higher octane juice even though its pricier it seems to balance out,I can definatly feel the difference too using high octane, much more responsive and you dont seem to have to push the throttle pedal as far to get the same as normal 95 ron, I will only use the higher octane stuff in performance cars though, its a waste of money putting in standard motors as I tried it in my wifes old Fiesta zetec and her pug 306 and it didnt make the slightest difference in perfromance that i could tell and didnt get any more mpg with it, havent tried the new fuel save stuff just yet but would be reluctant to use on a remapped car unless i really had no other choice, but thats just me :)

HADI
Thursday 12th August 2010, 18:51
i use v power all the time also, one thing i have noticed is that my mpg computer now states im doing 26.6 mpg which is good considering the car, my auto s70r was around 22.3 mpg at the time i had it, i also got a v power club card through from shell yest telling me they were upgrading me from the normal card to the v power card, it almost felt like something special for a nano second :crazy:

Flatout Phil
Sunday 15th August 2010, 14:57
Having always used VPower or other 99RON fuel ever since my RICA upgrade, and with forays into 95 RON petrol being met with fluffing and misfires under full boost, I thought I would give the new Shell Fuelsaver a try. Cynicaly I thought it woud be just a marketing mix, with punters unable to prove or disprove their claims of improved economy.

Amazingly I found it smoother than any other non-99 RON fuel, no significant misfire and only a marginal decrease in power from running on VPower. In fact I did not notice the difference until I switched back to VPower today!!. So for 113.9p vs 120.9p per litre I reckon its worth a try.

My belief is that the normal misfire under boost on low RON fuel is due to the ECU retarding the ignition when it detects knock. I may be wrong (any ideas anyone). Therefore it seems that using Fuelsaver may not be putting the engine in the knock zone even under boost so is better for the engine too??

Anyway on a steady run when I am not going to be booting it too hard I shall be happy to stick Feuelsaver in my beasty from here on, but use VPower for the more "enjoyable" trips.

Anyone have any evidence for or against??

Cheers

Woz.

I had to buy a tank of Tesco 99 the other day, never get anything other than VPower normally. Putting it through the gate today and guess what? Sporadic misfire under full boost. So won't be getting anymore of that. This car has never missed a beat, and whilst it was under boost, kept behaving like it had hit the rev limiter - like ecu was intervening! Now I have recently renewed the various vacumn pipes round the back of the airbox and so on, so maybe something there, but my money is on the fuel. It just isn't right for that map I think.

Storm-Troll
Sunday 15th August 2010, 18:56
I went to fill up today. I almost went for the new fuelsave pump but chickened out in the end and stuck wiv my V Power.... better the devil you know etc etc lol..

scr8pdo
Tuesday 24th August 2010, 19:13
Just a thought though, what were people using before V power came out with their Rica remaps? Shell Optimax was before V power IIRC, what was before that just out of interest, who remembers Formula Shell!

PS I seem to have missed out on trying this :(

http://www.bp.com/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=6621&contentId=7060376

SKIDMARKS
Tuesday 24th August 2010, 20:15
Only talking about this the other day when my son put in some 99 Tesco and it ran like a pig so he vowed never again.
I did say to him using v power in the t5 is like driving on a cold foggy day as compared to a hot dry day using other fuels if you get my meaning :confused:

scr8pdo
Wednesday 25th August 2010, 11:33
Only talking about this the other day when my son put in some 99 Tesco and it ran like a pig so he vowed never again.
I did say to him using v power in the t5 is like driving on a cold foggy day as compared to a hot dry day using other fuels if you get my meaning :confused:

Yeah definatly feel the difference with V power, but never had any probs with tesco 99, i only used it when in a hurry

They should bring back 5 star (as long as you got a decat lol)

princepugh
Wednesday 25th August 2010, 22:53
Well, my trip to Scotland didn't provide any conclusive results I'm afraid and what's more my overboost problems returned so the car was driving a bit erractically.

Anyways, I averaged 31.5 MPG from Sheffield to Ayr, which is disappointing but then the A70 is such a nice road it managed to ruin my average fuel economy! :)

On the return leg I filled up with Shell Fuelsave half way down the A74 and averaged 33.5 MPG back to Sheffield, via the A66 (cross Pennine) which I suppose is pretty good given the car was fully loaded with wife, kids and holiday gear; and boosting horribly. The car certainly seemed happy to run it and I've only just re-filled with VPower averaging out at 28 MPG since.

Whilst up in Scotland, I had to run on BP Ultimate (tsk, talk about lowering ones standards!) and I'd swear the car ran worse on that but maybe I'm biased :)

bubba_1986
Wednesday 25th August 2010, 23:03
Someone asked what was before v power it was shell optimax 97 Ron I believe

scr8pdo
Thursday 26th August 2010, 00:15
Someone asked what was before v power it was shell optimax 97 Ron I believe

Do you remember the old high octane gear, Formula Shell, 5 star petrol etc, now iam showing my age

The Flying Moose
Thursday 26th August 2010, 14:36
Do you remember the old high octane gear, Formula Shell, 5 star petrol etc, now iam showing my age

I dont remember 5 star that well but 4 star definately. I remember the first Volvo 440 my dad bought, it was the 1.7 Reno engine. That ran on 4 star or unleaded.

scr8pdo
Friday 27th August 2010, 16:43
I remember my grandad putting 2 or 3 star in his old Alfasud, I do remember all the different push buttons on the old petrol pumps 2,3,4 and 5 star and the single diesel pump in the corner of the forecourt for the lorries, no diesel cars back then, I was pretty young about 4 or 5 but i was always facinated with cars and anything that went with them so took a lot in, then I remember the introduction of unleaded, only one pump too, I also remember petrol actually smelling different than it does now (ex solvent abuser lol)

princepugh
Friday 27th August 2010, 17:00
There's a couple of old (classic?) cars that people up my steet run, including a MkII Cortina, very old Mini, Morris Marina (vomit); a Porsche (can't remember the model) and some kind of old sporty FIAT.

They're all pre CAT and probably have to run on the old stuff and TBH they smell like ££££ when you're running behind them.

It really does make you appreciate how much progress we've made with pollution control on cars.

The most evocative smell for me (steady on!) is Catrol R/ Duckams vegetable oil 2-stroke motorbike oil burn: fan-f*ck1ing-tastic smell!! :) Reminds me of going to see the bike racing with my Dad when I was a nipper - freezing cold, often rain sodden, but totally enthralling!! Seem to remember getting Steve Parishes (Stavros) autograph one time and being genuinely pant weeing about meeting him. Then one day at Cadwell, we'd stayed over the night in the caravan, a helicpoter flew in and landed over near the top loop. Fatha got the binocs out and spotted it was Barry Sheene! So we poddled over and had a chat to him, he was a cool guy and just chatted to us about the helicopter n stuff. *sob*

scr8pdo
Friday 27th August 2010, 18:22
There's a couple of old (classic?) cars that people up my steet run, including a MkII Cortina, very old Mini, Morris Marina (vomit); a Porsche (can't remember the model) and some kind of old sporty FIAT.

They're all pre CAT and probably have to run on the old stuff and TBH they smell like ££££ when you're running behind them.

It really does make you appreciate how much progress we've made with pollution control on cars.

The most evocative smell for me (steady on!) is Catrol R/ Duckams vegetable oil 2-stroke motorbike oil burn: fan-f*ck1ing-tastic smell!! :) Reminds me of going to see the bike racing with my Dad when I was a nipper - freezing cold, often rain sodden, but totally enthralling!! Seem to remember getting Steve Parishes (Stavros) autograph one time and being genuinely pant weeing about meeting him. Then one day at Cadwell, we'd stayed over the night in the caravan, a helicpoter flew in and landed over near the top loop. Fatha got the binocs out and spotted it was Barry Sheene! So we poddled over and had a chat to him, he was a cool guy and just chatted to us about the helicopter n stuff. *sob*



Oh yes, Castrol aaaR, that was a lovely smell, I used to race Motocross when I was a lad and a few of the chaps used to run that. If i smell that now it really takes me back (the petrolhead conosueirs choice) LOL

Bloody expensive stuff to buy the Castrol R, its pure catsor oil IIRC

mas
Sunday 29th August 2010, 19:06
5 Star petrol !! flaming hooje , I havn't remembered that for donkey's years.
Are you sure you're not 'too' old to drive a performance car :biggrin:

Come to think of it , am I too old to be driving performance cars



Mas

scr8pdo
Monday 30th August 2010, 08:17
5 Star petrol !! flaming hooje , I havn't remembered that for donkey's years.
Are you sure you're not 'too' old to drive a performance car :biggrin:

Come to think of it , am I too old to be driving performance cars



Mas

5 star had disapeared by the time i was old enough to drive, just remember it when i was very young, they were giving away Corgi cars at the BP garage round the coner, you had to save up Green shield stamps, I still got a couple of Corgi BP wrecker MK2 Transits lol

gmain1967
Monday 30th August 2010, 12:18
OK, time to admit my ignorance - what is the RON of the above?

I've seen it advertised and on forecourts, but not used it, and probably never will.

A recent item on VOC got me thinking about a few things, specifically in relation to the S40 T4 I had. Someone on there has had a T4 for a period and is having to get work done on the head, due to a burnt exhaust valve and deposit build up.

He knows from speaking to the previous owner, that the car was run only on lower grade 95RON fuel. Now it has been written various times that the lower grade fuel does not have the same cleaning additives and properties, that higher RON fuel has. My own opinion, is that this has had a direct bearing on the burnt valve problem, due to a build up of deposits.

On that basis, I'm just sticking to V Power and if all else fails, carry an octane booster, just in case. You might save a few quid with each tank, but if it ultimately means a new head or a rebuild, you need an awful lot of fills for that to make economic sense over a longer period....

scr8pdo
Monday 30th August 2010, 14:31
I think fuel saver is only 95 ron, il check and post back

scr8pdo
Monday 30th August 2010, 14:42
Apparently its available as 95 and 97 ron

princepugh
Tuesday 31st August 2010, 00:07
5 Star, didn't they do that song called 'Rain or Shine'? lol

AFAIAA Fuelsave is 95 RON so it's not really suitable if your running a remap and ragging it. BUT it does have the higher content of detergents and friction modifier, as per VPower so you pays your money and you takes your choice.

scr8pdo
Tuesday 31st August 2010, 10:48
5 Star, didn't they do that song called 'Rain or Shine'? lol

AFAIAA Fuelsave is 95 RON so it's not really suitable if your running a remap and ragging it. BUT it does have the higher content of detergents and friction modifier, as per VPower so you pays your money and you takes your choice.

LOL that lot (5 star) grew up near me when i lived down south, and if anyone has heard of 5 star batteries thats where the name came from, it was because the owners daughter was well into 5 star, I grew up with her from a baby, her dad Allen owns 5 star, hes a close friend of my dad


As for running 95 in a remapped car I think you would be askng for trouble, pre-ignition, pinking etc

princepugh
Tuesday 31st August 2010, 15:16
2 degrees of separation from 5 Star, who'd have thought it? :)

Barnsley-Bill
Thursday 2nd September 2010, 01:59
V power and 15% methanol in the tank hmmm lol

ANDY B
Friday 3rd September 2010, 10:02
V power and 15% methanol in the tank hmmm lol

Can I run Methanol or are there any rubber or plastic pipes on the fuel system? Methanol isn't very kind to them. Also it can eat through the seals on your fuel pump, possibly allowing vapors to the brushes kaboom:blowingup

gotmeaT-5
Friday 3rd September 2010, 20:12
I tried the new petrol from Shell didnt find it gave any extra infact it dropped my mileage from 30.2 on the Vpower down to a miserable 27.6. To add to the melting pot has anyone tried the new 99 Momentum from Tesco ? I tried it on a 400 mile round trip with horrible results of 24mpg

t5_monkey
Friday 3rd September 2010, 20:26
I think the words 'utter tosh' come to mind with all the so called claims - you get what you pay for.

Only fuel i ever used I could tell the difference with is V-power... I think if you have a tuned car you'd be mad to run it on anything else.

The Flying Moose
Friday 3rd September 2010, 23:36
I tried the new petrol from Shell didnt find it gave any extra infact it dropped my mileage from 30.2 on the Vpower down to a miserable 27.6. To add to the melting pot has anyone tried the new 99 Momentum from Tesco ? I tried it on a 400 mile round trip with horrible results of 24mpg

I tried the 99 momentum the other day as I didnt quite have enough fuel to reach the shell garage... not to keen on it to be honest. The car didnt seem to like it, didnt notice a massive difference econony wise between it and vpower.

Perhaps I am being too picky? They definately wont use as many additives as shell do.

Bash's 850 R
Sunday 12th September 2010, 22:59
I had to buy a tank of Tesco 99 the other day, never get anything other than VPower normally. Putting it through the gate today and guess what? Sporadic misfire under full boost. So won't be getting anymore of that. This car has never missed a beat, and whilst it was under boost, kept behaving like it had hit the rev limiter - like ecu was intervening! Now I have recently renewed the various vacumn pipes round the back of the airbox and so on, so maybe something there, but my money is on the fuel. It just isn't right for that map I think.

i used Vpower at shell in keighley and had similar issue under hard driving felt it was missing and coughing my mates accord type R beat me :( which was imbarrasing so this thread has got me thinking ??????