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TangoDeltaSierra3
Wednesday 22nd June 2005, 21:10
Hi, i noticed a few V70 police cars yesterday all with the geartronic gear system, i've seen the odd comment saying it's a poor gear box, can anyone offer any valued judgement on it. Thanks.

TonyR
Wednesday 22nd June 2005, 21:54
Hi, i noticed a few V70 police cars yesterday all with the geartronic gear system, i've seen the odd comment saying it's a poor gear box, can anyone offer any valued judgement on it. Thanks.
Essex plod have the V70 in geartronic huise. Have not heard any negative statements yet. Most of their vehicles are two or less years old.

TonyR

lance
Thursday 23rd June 2005, 10:27
Geartronic is slower than Auto or Manual its not as strong as either! Its also computer controlled and prone to gremlins particularly on early S80 T6!
Personally I would avoid unless really really really cheap!
Its a complex system that will leave your average auto specialist scratching his head after spending a week on it!

TangoDeltaSierra3
Thursday 23rd June 2005, 11:57
Geartronic is slower than Auto or Manual its not as strong as either! Its also computer controlled and prone to gremlins particularly on early S80 T6!
Personally I would avoid unless really really really cheap!
Its a complex system that will leave your average auto specialist scratching his head after spending a week on it!
I wonder why the police are buying cars with this system instead of manuals then, the 6 cars i saw were 51 reg or newer, i hope the S60s are manuals that there buying now in S.Yorkshire as i'm sat waiting for them to filter through the auctions.

V8guitar
Friday 24th June 2005, 14:17
I have a geartronic and used to have a P1 V70 with auto, so I reackon I can tell you the difference....

The geartronic is just like a regular auto with a manual override.....sounds ideal which is why I bought one and I suspect the cops have as well.

However, what they will discover is that the auto is slow changing in both auto and manual mode. Mine also has a fuel saving device that means there is a lag in engaging the gear when you release the brake. The net effect is that on take off its much slower than a regular auto as there is a delay of nearly 0.5 of a sec whilst it engages the gear. It is also less aggresive in its changes and so throughout its acceleration, its less punchy at changes. Its also not that smooth!!!

The only advantage over a regular auto is if you want to engage a gear early, so you come upm behnid a car, know hes going to gun it and change down in advance so that the engine/turbo is already spooled up. But this is less of an advantage over the regualr auto when using Sport mode as they shift pretty quickly anway!!

The last run at Avon, I tried the power brake technique to build some revs and improve take off. This is what happened....
Brake on, in 1st in manual mode, give it some throttle.
Released the brake and nailed the throttle...car pulls away pretty well.
Hits boost, wheels spin, revs fly round and I change gear
Geartronic "thinks" about this and decides to shift.
By this time hit rev limiter, revs drop off, car splutters and forward trust stops momentarily.

Clearly this does not make for impressive take offs!!

I am now convinced that my gearbox cost me at least 0.5 if not 1 sec off my 1/4 mile because I stayed with every car I raced but everyone beat me off the lights with similar reaction times. I also ran the same time as another geartronic.

So its OK as a gearbox in general but tends to give the worst of both worlds rather than the best. If you want max performance, go manual. If you want a bit of luxury without too much loss of performance, go Auto. If you like gadgets so that your kids can change gear for you, go Geartronic.

Its not total doom and gloom, but I would not have another geartronic unless its dramtically improved.

TangoDeltaSierra3
Friday 24th June 2005, 14:57
Thanks for that, sounds like it won't suit me at all.

Matt30462
Friday 24th June 2005, 15:48
i hope the S60s are manuals that there buying now in S.Yorkshire as i'm sat waiting for them to filter through the auctions.

Thought you would want them to get Geartronics, that way when they are chasing you you are that little bit faster and they breakdown, leaving you to dissappear off into the sunset.

TangoDeltaSierra3
Friday 24th June 2005, 19:11
Thought you would want them to get Geartronics, that way when they are chasing you you are that little bit faster and they breakdown, leaving you to dissappear off into the sunset.
What u mean Matt, i'm a very sedate driver lol, seriously tho does anyone know if the new S60 cop cars are geartronic or does it vary force to force ?

After_Shock
Saturday 25th June 2005, 00:00
Must be force to force, all the ones we get in at work are manuals, even the undercover D5's are manuals.

V8guitar
Saturday 25th June 2005, 19:52
The V70's I've seen in Notts are manuals as well....

V8guitar
Saturday 25th June 2005, 19:59
Oh, and I'm very excited because someone on this site suggested there is a software upgrade for the geartronic and my car goes in to the dealer next Thurs and they are doing the upgrade - they are charging me for the pleasure though!!! :remybussi

I'll let you know how it goes...

highgun
Saturday 25th June 2005, 23:03
I don’t think you will have the same negative opinion to the Geartronic once you have the software upgrade!!!

It only cost me about £40.00 - £50.00 for the upgrade, and you won’t have that silly fuel saving device: (when you have your foot on the brake and release it, you will go without hesitation!!)

My quickest time with the Geartronic at Avon was 15.1 seconds, I think it should improve by around 1 second.

All the best,

Tony.

TangoDeltaSierra3
Sunday 26th June 2005, 22:22
Oh, and I'm very excited because someone on this site suggested there is a software upgrade for the geartronic and my car goes in to the dealer next Thurs and they are doing the upgrade - they are charging me for the pleasure though!!! :remybussi

I'll let you know how it goes...
Cool keep us posted them, i may be comverted yet.

V8guitar
Monday 27th June 2005, 10:07
I don’t think you will have the same negative opinion to the Geartronic once you have the software upgrade!!!

It only cost me about £40.00 - £50.00 for the upgrade, and you won’t have that silly fuel saving device: (when you have your foot on the brake and release it, you will go without hesitation!!)

My quickest time with the Geartronic at Avon was 15.1 seconds, I think it should improve by around 1 second.

All the best,

Tony.

I knew someone recommended the upgrade but couldn't remember who.....so I hope it does change the characteristics.

Also glad you were charged as I was worried they were taking the Micheal....

I'll get a chance to test and Nurbergring a week Friday...oh, did I slip that into the conversation ???

TangoDeltaSierra3
Monday 4th July 2005, 15:48
Have you had the upgrade yet, i've seen a nice V70P2 with geartronic, let me know asap after the upgrade if its improved.

philt6
Monday 4th July 2005, 16:16
Mine is an S80T6 Geartronic Done 96000 miles roughly i've had no problems with it. does the job when you need it. Even better when you turn traction off and use it as a manual

TangoDeltaSierra3
Monday 4th July 2005, 16:46
Mine is an S80T6 Geartronic Done 96000 miles roughly i've had no problems with it. does the job when you need it. Even better when you turn traction off and use it as a manualYes but some people say its too slow to react/engage, hence the software upgrade, have you had the upgrade yet?

philt6
Monday 4th July 2005, 17:07
I wouldn't say it was slow to react. reaction time is footdown drops a cog and goes. i haven't had the upgrade done but previous owner might have.in manual just a case of flicking stick down and flooring it.

TangoDeltaSierra3
Monday 4th July 2005, 18:34
Mmmmm, i wonder at what age the gremlins will start to affect them. It aint gonna be cheap to get it looked at if/when it decides to play up.

highgun
Monday 4th July 2005, 21:03
Mmmmm, i wonder at what age the gremlins will start to affect them. It aint gonna be cheap to get it looked at if/when it decides to play up.




Mines done 122000 miles, with no problems. Hade a RICA done around February, and I went a bit mad for the first time last weekend: in auto 3rd gear pulled to an indicated 100 mph, 4th gear pulled to 150 mph, in to 5th and it went off the clock! Around 170 mph with 1000 rpm to go!

Err, I wouldn’t say it was a bit slow!

All the best,

Tony.

V8guitar
Monday 4th July 2005, 21:09
Upgraded today....

To answer the question, some geartronics have something called "neutral control" that was introduced over a certain time period. This means that when you come to a standstill, it flicks into neutral and when you want to pull away, it has to engage 1st which takes almost .5 second.

This, plus the fact that swapping cogs up the gearbox is slower than a regular auto, means it definately is slower. As for the manual override, its so slow to change up i.e. its not instant by any stretch of the imagination, that you have to change up .5 to 1 sec earlier than you want to so that you time it right.....not ideal! Hence the auto really makes the manual mode redundant except for changing down in advance so that you are ready to go. The kick down is not the problem, and it does react as well if not better than the old economy/sport mode as it adapts to your driving style.

So has the upgrade worked ? Well, yes and no. It does now "creep" like a regular auto or as if you had manually engaged 1st. It doesn't seem to change gear any quicker, so I still think its not as good as my "old" auto in my P1 V70. However, not had a chance to really drive it so its difficult to really give an update.

Steve is going to have a go in mine and he has an auto P1 so he can give a verdict after this weekend.

Tango - I would try and get to drive one. If you don't like it, don't rely on the upgrade to sort it 'cos it doesn't seem to totally fix it! Sorry! Don't get me wrong, its not disaterous and my car still goes pretty damn fast, but its definately inferior to the regular auto and manual on performance. Slightly disappointed...but it was worth it.

philt6
Monday 4th July 2005, 21:36
Mines done 122000 miles, with no problems. Hade a RICA done around February, and I went a bit mad for the first time last weekend: in auto 3rd gear pulled to an indicated 100 mph, 4th gear pulled to 150 mph, in to 5th and it went off the clock! Around 170 mph with 1000 rpm to go!

Err, I wouldn’t say it was a bit slow!

All the best,

Tony.
What car you using and how much was the rica if you don't mind me asxing

V8guitar
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 15:25
Mines done 122000 miles, with no problems. Hade a RICA done around February, and I went a bit mad for the first time last weekend: in auto 3rd gear pulled to an indicated 100 mph, 4th gear pulled to 150 mph, in to 5th and it went off the clock! Around 170 mph with 1000 rpm to go!

Err, I wouldn’t say it was a bit slow!

All the best,

Tony.

I would agree that top wack is fine as I was shocked when mine stayed in 4th to at least 140 mph... Not had it much faster yet.

So geartronic does not affect the top speed ( as this is more down to ratios than shifting) and has slight affect through the gears in auto, but nothing major. Its on take off that has been the problem.

I've mentioned before that I was disappointed at Avon mainly due to take off from the lights. All cars I raced pulled 2 car lengths before my motor AND my gearbox "caught up". I feel that the Rica has helped significantly gain back performance "lost" at take off higher up the rev range.

With the "box" upgrade, I think I may have shaved .5 off my 0-60, perhaps more. Although this is not the best measure of performance, I'll happily take .5 off any of my times....

This is purely subjective and may have made no difference, so who knows!! Its probably all in my head!

lance
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 15:50
Well this thread has taught me that the later geartronic must be much more reliable compared to the early S80 T6,
What amazes me is why does the R only have 350Nm against 400nm!
5th gear sounds amazing & 170mph+ (as far as Im aware the 850s and classic manuals are limited by gears to 171mph.
Im not sure about P2 cars though!
I would be intrested what Nm figure a rica would produce against a manual of same condition etc? Also top speeds?acceleration as I suspect the manual will have more bottom end but the Geartronic have a higher top speed

highgun
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 17:08
I would agree that top wack is fine as I was shocked when mine stayed in 4th to at least 140 mph... Not had it much faster yet.

So geartronic does not affect the top speed ( as this is more down to ratios than shifting) and has slight affect through the gears in auto, but nothing major. Its on take off that has been the problem.

I've mentioned before that I was disappointed at Avon mainly due to take off from the lights. All cars I raced pulled 2 car lengths before my motor AND my gearbox "caught up". I feel that the Rica has helped significantly gain back performance "lost" at take off higher up the rev range.

With the "box" upgrade, I think I may have shaved .5 off my 0-60, perhaps more. Although this is not the best measure of performance, I'll happily take .5 off any of my times....

This is purely subjective and may have made no difference, so who knows!! Its probably all in my head!



I found with my gearbox upgrade that it took about a week for it to learn my driving style.

I am also using 99ron petrol from Tesco, and the car has turned into an animal, it just keeps pulling!! Take off from the lights is still a little slow (around a two second lag) but then it just takes off, and I am struggling for traction even with 235 40 18 Michelin Pilots.

It will be interesting to see how the geartronic cars perform on the ¼ mile after the upgrade.

All the best,

Tony.

John Ret.
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 17:12
A 2 second delay definatly doesn't appeal to me, but you know..... different strokes and all....

TangoDeltaSierra3
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 17:45
Well i've been on a test drive today in a S2 V70 T5 SE and all i can say is i'm CONVERTED, it was ace, best of both worlds as far as i can see, auto or man, it was very heavy rain too but the car pulled impressively etc, altho it was only a short test drive i think i like it. Then sods law i called at the auctions on my way home and spotted an S60 T5 SE with my name on it and it's blooming manual, i can't believe it. Decisions Decisions! :B_steerin

highgun
Tuesday 5th July 2005, 19:35
Well i've been on a test drive today in a S2 V70 T5 SE and all i can say is i'm CONVERTED, it was ace, best of both worlds as far as i can see, auto or man, it was very heavy rain too but the car pulled impressively etc, altho it was only a short test drive i think i like it. Then sods law i called at the auctions on my way home and spotted an S60 T5 SE with my name on it and it's blooming manual, i can't believe it. Decisions Decisions! :B_steerin



Glad you like it!.

To be honest I use the auto option for 99 % of my driving, and the manual for the twisty bits.

Tony.

V8guitar
Wednesday 6th July 2005, 19:55
Well i've been on a test drive today in a S2 V70 T5 SE and all i can say is i'm CONVERTED, it was ace, best of both worlds as far as i can see, auto or man, it was very heavy rain too but the car pulled impressively etc, altho it was only a short test drive i think i like it. Then sods law i called at the auctions on my way home and spotted an S60 T5 SE with my name on it and it's blooming manual, i can't believe it. Decisions Decisions! :B_steerin

I love my V70 but would rather have a manual or regular auto. Seriously I would re-check the geartronic 'cos initially I thought it was great but then started to discover its short comings when pushing hard...

The only prob for me with an S60 is I think they are a little bland externally, so as long as you don't mind that, I would go for the S60!!

In fact, my next car is very likely an S60.....T5 or R...Which ever you go for you'll be happy!!

blackrat2
Friday 8th July 2005, 18:09
Hi mate

I hve to agree with v8's comments, i drove one for a couple of days on my advanced course, it was so smoothe that i tried to talk the instructor into letting me do my final drive in one
However having owned a p1 and currently the owner of a manual p2 and having the plesure of having both a manual and geartronic at work to play with, the novelty factor of the geartronic has gone.

They are boring to drive even in manual mode, and when doing blue light runs its a job to keep your eyes on the road and remeber what gear the cars in when you come to a bend.
We have a y reg which goes into neutral, at times it is an almighty kick type feeling when this happens, and your left wondering if youve had a shunt, the car is forever in repair and has just had a new gearbox fitted.
I think our force only got two of them before they realised the money was better spent on the manuals.

V8guitar
Tuesday 12th July 2005, 15:41
Having thorough road tested the car this weekend on a trip to Nurburgring, I can say the upgrade is worth having done as it does improve it, but only to the standard of a normal auto.

Therefore if you want novelty and jerky take offs, choose geartronic with Neutral control. If you want smooth fast performance, choose ordinary auto or geartronic without Neutral control. If you want max performance, manual.

mat562be
Sunday 31st July 2005, 13:58
I wonder why the police are buying cars with this system instead of manuals then, the 6 cars i saw were 51 reg or newer, i hope the S60s are manuals that there buying now in S.Yorkshire as i'm sat waiting for them to filter through the auctions.

ACPO guidelines say that any car fitted with a ProVida VASCAR system should, unless habitually double-crewed, be fitted with an "automatic" gearbox to lessen the distraction value to the driver whilst operating the system and driving simultaneously. For that reason, you see more than a few auto boxes in use in RPG cars..

TangoDeltaSierra3
Sunday 31st July 2005, 14:07
ACPO guidelines say that any car fitted with a ProVida VASCAR system should, unless habitually double-crewed, be fitted with an "automatic" gearbox to lessen the distraction value to the driver whilst operating the system and driving simultaneously. For that reason, you see more than a few auto boxes in use in RPG cars..So are the new S60's auto too Matt ? I bought a manual now anyway!

mat562be
Sunday 31st July 2005, 19:31
Notts are still buying mainly V70s, and as far as I know they are all (could be wrong, but haven't seen any myself) manual boxes.

South Yorks are having a buying spree on S60s at the moment. Most of the newer RPG cars are S60as opposed to V70s, although the armed cars seem to be still mainly V70s.

Most of the newer S60s I've seen at one of their RPG Wings were autos...

TangoDeltaSierra3
Sunday 31st July 2005, 22:18
Notts are still buying mainly V70s, and as far as I know they are all (could be wrong, but haven't seen any myself) manual boxes.

South Yorks are having a buying spree on S60s at the moment. Most of the newer RPG cars are S60as opposed to V70s, although the armed cars seem to be still mainly V70s.

Most of the newer S60s I've seen at one of their RPG Wings were autos...Yes i was told that all new Traffic vehicles would be saloons and the V70's moved on to ARV role - can't see the S60's being much good for carrying kit/shovel/brush etc...just disappointing they turning to the auto box.

Baldrick
Sunday 7th August 2005, 21:31
Hi there

Have been reading through this thread and would like to advise that my T5 (late 2002) would appear to have the Geartronic software update (removing the Neutral Contorl function) as standard, as when in manual and stopping the gearbox drops to 1st and remains there even when at a complete stop. Pick up from standstill in this mode is exceptionally rapid with little if any lag and quick than when running in auto mode.

Unless you are a dedicated speed fanatic then I think that that the Geartronic box gives yo the best of both worlds; effortless transits in auto but with the ability to go manual when yo need/require.

Each to their own!

Regards




Baldrick

TangoDeltaSierra3
Sunday 7th August 2005, 23:23
Hi there

Have been reading through this thread and would like to advise that my T5 (late 2002) would appear to have the Geartronic software update (removing the Neutral Contorl function) as standard, as when in manual and stopping the gearbox drops to 1st and remains there even when at a complete stop. Pick up from standstill in this mode is exceptionally rapid with little if any lag and quick than when running in auto mode.

Unless you are a dedicated speed fanatic then I think that that the Geartronic box gives yo the best of both worlds; effortless transits in auto but with the ability to go manual when yo need/require.

Each to their own!

Regards




BaldrickThanks for that & welcome, i've since chosen the manual S60 route but never say never!

Baldrick
Monday 8th August 2005, 11:55
Hi TangoDeltaSierra3

Thanks for the welcome.

V8guitar
Monday 8th August 2005, 12:57
Yeah, I believe they took off the Neutral control in 2002 so that fits....

For me, the geartronic would be fab if the up shifts were faster instead of sluuurrrring into the next gear. As a result, manual mode is no quicker, in fact its probably slower as the auto seems to respond quicker. The only benefit I have found is the ability to "pre-select" a gear in readiness...

Anyway, don't want people to think I'm too down on it as I still love my car and I love the auto....just think its a missed opportunatey by Volvo as it could have been so much better.

Baldrick
Monday 8th August 2005, 13:48
Hi V8guitar

Strange.......I do not detect any sluuurrrring as you put it and I think that the manual is quicker than the auto option if you just change you gear selection method to selecting the gear manually a second earlier than you would in a normal manual gearbox........this is 'contra instinctive' but once you get the hang of it you sort of eliminate the 'lag' that every one seems to refer to, ie, the revs continue to build to the right point when the change kicks in.

Well, seems to work for me but then again I am not really a speedster.

Best regards



Baldrick

akky
Tuesday 6th June 2006, 15:51
For me, the geartronic would be fab if the up shifts were faster instead of sluuurrrring into the next gear. .

mmm sluuurrrring..... I'm liking this thread as I'm hell bent on getting a geartronic. My impression is that it learns the way you drive. Is sluuuring not something you do when drunk. MAybe it's learning when you have a hangover.....

Seriously, some good discussion, it does seem that in the end, it's only in 'race' type situations whe you will notice the difference. day to day, each gearbox has its own merits. Anyway, I'm getting closer to a descision. off to do some more reading.

Steve

Tony Bromley
Sunday 11th June 2006, 23:00
Due to a bad left ankle I have had for years to use automatic boxes. Rovers, Fords, Vauxhall, Citroen. The Volvo geartronic is the best in thirty years, especially being able to select manual on awkward climbs and descents. A great gearbox. Fuel consumption is better than manual.

mickys60t5
Sunday 11th June 2006, 23:09
you have driven a geartronic t.d.s

TangoDeltaSierra3
Sunday 11th June 2006, 23:59
you have driven a geartronic t.d.sYes Michael but not last June when i started this thread lol....:troutslap