removing ABS & PAS

[p fandango]

ever since i brought the car i've never liked ABS, so now everything is being stripped off it how easy it to remove. I know several ways to turn it off but i actually want as much of the system (pump, ecu) removed. Is it just a case of ripping it out & making new pipes from the brake servo?

& how about the power steering, if i removed the pump (& fitted a shorter aux belt) what do you do about the rack. Do you run it dry or fill it with fluid & bung up the pipe outlets?

many thanks Duane

PS what else can i remove lol

[Alan M]

I would keep some fluid in the rack as letting it go dry if your not changing it, may result in damaged parts causing some problems when you don't want them. I would suggest looking at changing the pipework to and from the servo/master cylinder for your brakes. It sounds like an interesting subgect removing the ABS. Is this a weight saving project? Have you removed all the plastic arch liners and door bump strips- every little helps.

[lance]

ABS is useless in the snow, but it saved my life once in the rain! Why dont you strap the T5 engine and gearbox to a shopping trolley lol or an industrial skate board!

[p fandango]

I would keep some fluid in the rack as letting it go dry if your not changing it, may result in damaged parts causing some problems when you don't want them. I would suggest looking at changing the pipework to and from the servo/master cylinder for your brakes. It sounds like an interesting subgect removing the ABS.
thanks, i think that probably sounds the most sensible thing to do


Is this a weight saving project? Have you removed all the plastic arch liners and door bump strips- every little helps.
the front arch linings fell off ages ago, rears are on the "to do" list. I'd like to keep the outside looking normal(ish), i could drill out the door skin behind the bumpstrips then put them back on

[p fandango]

ABS is useless in the snow, but it saved my life once in the rain! Why dont you strap the T5 engine and gearbox to a shopping trolley lol or an industrial skate board!
think i've had the ABS cut-in once, & that was when i braked to hard showing off

i'm going to keep it road-legal (just) but like the idea of the skate board lol

[850 2.5 10v]

Removal of PAS???

At standstill you would not be able to turn the steering wheel without PAS.

It would make the car a challenge to drive given the weight of it.

If you want to cut weight remove the boot boards, spare wheel and rear seats.

Easy and quick.

[dooby]

Hiya,

I was under the impression (possibly wrongly) that turning the steering wheel with the power assist off (e.g. engine not running) is not a fair test of how heavy the system would be with PAS *removed*. I understood that with the system off you're fighting against it, pushing the fluid around yourself as well as trying to turn the wheels.

With the system properly removed, you wouldn't be fighting against it, so it would be feel lighter than when you might try this with the engine off.

Anyone got any thoughts on this? Did Russ remove PAS from his yellow speed demon? I can't remember...

Cheers, Pete

[p fandango]

Removal of PAS???

At standstill you would not be able to turn the steering wheel without PAS.

It would make the car a challenge to drive given the weight of it.
i do realise it will make it heavier but can't see it being impossible once moving, i've owned/drove many cars without PAS including a 4x4


If you want to cut weight remove the boot boards, spare wheel and rear seats.

Easy and quick.
no offence intended but i'm going a bit further than that, i've already been in talks with Tomcat about replacing some of the Volvo metal with Carbon Fibre :B_thumb:

[850 2.5 10v]

Are you creating a track day special?

If so you can pretty much loose the entire interior, door cards, leccy motors, windows can become plastic, headlining.....etc..

I'm on your wave length now.

Get the a/c gone too as that weighs a fair bit too.

[p fandango]

Are you creating a track day special?

If so you can pretty much loose the entire interior, door cards, leccy motors, windows can become plastic, headlining.....etc..

I'm on your wave length now.

Get the a/c gone too as that weighs a fair bit too.
track day, quarter mile, weekend fun car really

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/eb2b4b3a1b.jpg
Polycarbonate windows are already on the list & the heater blower is already in the bin (not got a/c). Got to remove the dashtop & take all the ventilation pipes/box out next

[p fandango]

Hiya,

I was under the impression (possibly wrongly) that turning the steering wheel with the power assist off (e.g. engine not running) is not a fair test of how heavy the system would be with PAS *removed*. I understood that with the system off you're fighting against it, pushing the fluid around yourself as well as trying to turn the wheels.

With the system properly removed, you wouldn't be fighting against it, so it would be feel lighter than when you might try this with the engine off.

Anyone got any thoughts on this? Did Russ remove PAS from his yellow speed demon? I can't remember...

Cheers, Pete
it does make sense, with it still connected up your fighting against the pump even tho its not working. But would you still be doing the same with it removed & the steering rack pipes sealed up because its then a closed system which would be under pressure from the enclosed fluid which can't go anywhere

edit = so if it had a simple pipe straight from the steering rack outlet circling back to the inlet the fluid can be pushed around, it'll still be sealed within the system but the rack won't be locked (in theory)

[dooby]

edit = so if it had a simple pipe straight from the steering rack outlet circling back to the inlet the fluid can be pushed around, it'll still be sealed within the system but the rack won't be locked (in theory)

Yeah, that sounds like it might work to me - let's hope someone who has better knowledge can confirm/deny :-)

Otherwise, I suppose if it doesn't work having the outlet and inlet joined for whatever reason, maybe the outlet coming in to the top of a half-full tank, and the inlet taking fluid from the bottom of that tank. That method gives some room for compression/expansion in the tank (if that's necessary for the operation of this system).

Cheers, Pete

[p fandango]

Did Russ remove PAS from his yellow speed demon? I can't remember...
i guess not

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/540f4cc310.jpg

[neevo]

Get a bigger steering wheel (larger diameter) that will help steering and needn't be that much heavier - the one on ky old VW was quite thin and that had no power steering

[tandino]

For the weight saving possible - ie about 5 or so kg i wouldn't bother taking the PAS off.
The car is too heavy for a manual quick rack so your not going to get rid of the steering rack itself, the pumps dont weigh alot at all.
The millionth of a second you might make will be countered by the extra effort and time you need to turn the wheel!!!!

[thebadger]

Just have a really good dump before you drive... :biggrin:

Lighter alloys would save you about the same!

Did you remove the bonnet cover (heat sheild)?

All the door locks & bits like the check straps, then spot weld the doors shut!

Ariel, aero flat wipers, rear wiper removal? Plastic rear window too??

I like where it's going tho!

[RT MECHANICS]

i guess not

http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/540f4cc310.jpg

I did not remove the Pas i have not given it much thought for the small amount of weight saving there is much much more on the car you can remove first if you take the wiring out you no longer need you can save far far more and still have decent steering.....

Russ

[p fandango]

Lighter alloys would save you about the same!
i'll have to weigh the alloys & see how they compare to Volvo's own, not that they'll be changed tho as i like the exterior look


Did you remove the bonnet cover (heat sheild)?
that went many years ago, & the scuttle panel


All the door locks & bits like the check straps, then spot weld the doors shut!
hmm not sure about welding the doors up, it is staying road legal for some weekend fun. Check straps can go tho


Ariel, aero flat wipers, rear wiper removal? Plastic rear window too??
aerial, radio, speakers, wiring all gone. Mine is a saloon so not got a rear wiper & going to stick with normal glass rear screen


I like where it's going tho!
you'd really like some of my ideas then :banana:

[p fandango]

I did not remove the Pas i have not given it much thought for the small amount of weight saving there is much much more on the car you can remove first if you take the wiring out you no longer need you can save far far more and still have decent steering.....

Russ
every little helps lol

alot of the unused wiring has already been removed & amazed at how much there was (plastic trunking alone weighs 2.2kg), i have still got alot more to get rid of but just making the list up of "jobs to do". Not looking forwrd to removing the dash top but can't see any other way to get the heater box/pipes out

[Nuckin Futs]

The ABS and PAS both take a small amount of HP off the engine to run.
On my old 760 I took off the Aircon belt and it give me better MPG
so when it was off it was still dragging some power.

Jeff

[RT MECHANICS]

every little helps lol

alot of the unused wiring has already been removed & amazed at how much there was (plastic trunking alone weighs 2.2kg), i have still got alot more to get rid of but just making the list up of "jobs to do". Not looking forwrd to removing the dash top but can't see any other way to get the heater box/pipes out

I have a friend who is making a rather fast Evo he removed the excess wiring and weighed it from memory it was 12 kg :) the sunroof and cassette is about 17 kg the dash is no bother i have it down to a fine art !!! I did think of getting rid of the heater and box but decided it would be good to have some sort of demister :)

Russ

[Loadsamiles]

Not sure how relevant it is.

I ran mine with no fluid in the PAS system (not very far,,,LOL)

Without PAS the car is impossible to drive. Not even a gorilla could drive it.

Swapping the rack for a non PAS one may be a better option.

I've driven vehicles that are heavier at the front that don't have PAS. (Ford Transit diesel comes to mind) But the steering gear on them is designed for manual operation.

[thebadger]

From the pic it looked like an estate!

Door cards!

They're still on in the pic!

Boot inner card too!

Thought of a CF bonnet? Or even FG?

I do not see how welding rear & passenger doors shut (spot weld not solid) would make the car illegal to drive! I think you'd find loads of heavy weight in the doors that you could chuck.. I see you're getting shot of the glass, so motors, frames, winders, lock servos....

Big list for doors!

Did we do the headliner?

Sun visors?

Fit a plug to the bottom of the windscreen wiper resivoir & drain it prior to events!

[p fandango]

I have a friend who is making a rather fast Evo he removed the excess wiring and weighed it from memory it was 12 kg :) the sunroof and cassette is about 17 kg the dash is no bother i have it down to a fine art !!! I did think of getting rid of the heater and box but decided it would be good to have some sort of demister :)
i've got the sunroof to remove yet, & already got me a plug-in 12volt ceramic heater lol

[p fandango]

Not sure how relevant it is.

I ran mine with no fluid in the PAS system (not very far,,,LOL)

Without PAS the car is impossible to drive. Not even a gorilla could drive it.

Swapping the rack for a non PAS one may be a better option.

I've driven vehicles that are heavier at the front that don't have PAS. (Ford Transit diesel comes to mind) But the steering gear on them is designed for manual operation.
good point, i don't think any 850's came without PAS tho so see how it goes if i do get round to that

[p fandango]

From the pic it looked like an estate!
can assure you its not lol


Door cards!

They're still on in the pic!

Boot inner card too!
door cards will be going once i get some lightweight plastic sheeting & the manual window winders, boot cards have gone its my Volvo rug & tools (they won't be stopping there)


Thought of a CF bonnet? Or even FG?
i think we should talk Tomcat into doing CF bonnets if we can organise plenty of us interested. I've been in talks with him about doing a CF roof skin so i can remove the sunroof (& some of the metal)


I do not see how welding rear & passenger doors shut (spot weld not solid) would make the car illegal to drive! I think you'd find loads of heavy weight in the doors that you could chuck.. I see you're getting shot of the glass, so motors, frames, winders, lock servos....

Big list for doors!
i know several people who failed an MOT for removing the external door handles because the emergency services wouldn't be able to get in if involved in an accident, i'd of thought it would fall into the same category. I have still got a quick release passenger seat to go in, the plan is go to the Nurburg ring later on the year & want some company for a run like that


Did we do the headliner?

Sun visors?
gone (& grab handles)


Fit a plug to the bottom of the windscreen wiper resivoir & drain it prior to events!
i've already got a smaller capacity bottle fitted

thanks for all the ideas tho, keep them coming folks

[thebadger]

How about a large helium ballon in the rear?

[850 2.5 10v]

good point, i don't think any 850's came without PAS tho so see how it goes if i do get round to that

That was one of my points in an earlier post in this thread....

[PaulZX]

some 440's were non-power steering, would that be an option?

[p fandango]

some 440's were non-power steering, would that be an option?
i've had a quick look thru Vadis but can't see any numbers that tie together, & tbh i'd of thought the narrower track of the 440 would mean it'd be no good

[Tim Williams]

i've had a quick look thru Vadis but can't see any numbers that tie together, & tbh i'd of thought the narrower track of the 440 would mean it'd be no good

A narrower track does not mean a narrower rack, a Mk3/4 Escort has a longer rack as it has shorter track rod ends.