At last it starts...

[jonj]

So after being at the electrician for two days he decided the car was immobised but couldn't decide what it was.

They changed the transponder in the ign barrel and it didn't help.

I decided to get the car moved to a Volvo main dealer so I paid my bill with the first garage (£280), paid the recovery guy (£70) and left it with the Volvo main dealer in Basingstoke.

They called me later that afternoon to say they had started it.

The did the following:

Found imm code IMM-321 ign signal, ecm signal missing
Checked antena ring connections - ok
Checked coil - ok
Checked fly Wheel sensor - ok
Checked wiring for open circuit or resistance between ecu and imm - ok
Removed ECU and Imm cleaned connections and re-fitted- Car Started!!!

Can you believe it!!!

We have spent over £600 on the car and it had dirty terminals!

Thank you all for your suggestions

[Andrew]

<clensed by author>

[neevo]

Get yourself a can of electrical contact cleaner - it sounds like it wil be a good investment. About &#163;5 from Maplins and worth every penny, I fixed a "no noises" horn by dousing the contacts behind the airbag with it so just imagine what you could be saving/doing.

Glad you are back and running.

[jonj]

BISON are you reading this ?

Are you having similar problems?

[Adge]

So after being at the electrician for two days he decided the car was immobised but couldn't decide what it was.

They changed the transponder in the ign barrel and it didn't help.

I decided to get the car moved to a Volvo main dealer so I paid my bill with the first garage (£280), paid the recovery guy (£70) and left it with the Volvo main dealer in Basingstoke.

They called me later that afternoon to say they had started it.

The did the following:

Found imm code IMM-321 ign signal, ecm signal missing
Checked antena ring connections - ok
Checked coil - ok
Checked fly Wheel sensor - ok
Checked wiring for open circuit or resistance between ecu and imm - ok
Removed ECU and Imm cleaned connections and re-fitted- Car Started!!!

Can you believe it!!!

We have spent over £600 on the car and it had dirty terminals!

Thank you all for your suggestions
I'm pleased it's sorted for you jonj. These sort of sagas throw the normal routines of life.

[Andrew]

<clensed by author>

[jonj]

It is an expensive job checking everythihng else, almost worth checking it first as it doesn't cost anything.

The symptoms were the car was immobilsed, no spark coming from the coil.

[arbee]

well as you say - at least its sorted!

[shaun850]

BISON are you reading this ?

I was going to say that :)

His car is living @ VT so hopefully they will sort it for him :)

[Andrew]

<clensed by author>

[jonj]

Everything was going so well. On the way back from London yesterday I stopped to get something to eat. Came out to the car and it wouldn't start. Exactly the same thing. Called the AA and just as they turned up it started it!

I dr4ove it home and played with it on my drive for a bit, it seemed to be fine. I tried to start it this morning, same thing. Just turns over but still no spark!

I turned the key to position three then quickly turned it of and then back to three again and it started!

It is going back to the main dealer tomorrow :cry:

[Paullyp]

If you have an 850, bet you a pound to a penny that it is the relay which operates the fuel injection system that is faulty, this will cause intermittent starting and the loss of your spark, part number 3545803, COSTS £21,does not show up when doing a diagnostic check,P.:biggrin:

[Andrew]

<clensed by author>

[Paullyp]

If you have an 850, bet you a pound to a penny that it is the relay which operates the fuel injection system that is faulty, this will cause intermittent starting and the loss of your spark, part number 3545803, COSTS &#163;21,does not show up when doing a diagnostic check,P.:biggrin:
This relay is situated under the radiator cowling, takes 5 secs to remove, on opening the relay it has a set of contact points, the points can sometime fuse together, eventually they will free themselves, usually after you have changed the flywheel sensor, cambelt sensor and the coilpack. Ever 850 owner should carry a spare, if your car fails to start, change this relay before you head off to the garage, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.
A guy gave me a call the other day to tell me he had changed his turbo hoses for SAMCO ones and his car wouldn't start, yep you have guessed right, on fixing the top hose had knocked the relay and lost the connection.If anyone needs any clarification on this relay, pm me with a contact number,Paullyp:santawave

[jonj]

This relay is situated under the radiator cowling, takes 5 secs to remove, on opening the relay it has a set of contact points, the points can sometime fuse together, eventually they will free themselves, usually after you have changed the flywheel sensor, cambelt sensor and the coilpack. Ever 850 owner should carry a spare, if your car fails to start, change this relay before you head off to the garage, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.
A guy gave me a call the other day to tell me he had changed his turbo hoses for SAMCO ones and his car wouldn't start, yep you have guessed right, on fixing the top hose had knocked the relay and lost the connection.If anyone needs any clarification on this relay, pm me with a contact number,Paullyp:santawave

Hi Paul,

This is the same issue I spoke to you on the phone about 2 weeks ago. I have a V70 and the relay seems to be different to the 850.

The Garage had it today and it started everytime they tried it, no codes stored in either the ECU or Immobilser. They are going to change the Cam sensor tomorrow as this is the last part to change.

The Relay I have under the radiator cowling doesn't look like it comes apart. Do you know if it is the same as the 850?

[gareth]

I'm 200% behind Paul on this one. My car was a non runner too with all the same symptoms as yours. The garage replaced sensors and a coil/amp etc all to no avail and one quick call to "paul the Volvo fixing Guru" later and it ran!
The problem with mine wasn't the actual relay but the wires on the connector to the relay. I've seen this problem on one other post here.
Trust Paul, use the force!!!

[Paullyp]

If your relay does not have the part no 3545803, I expect your is the later type engine and what you are looking at is the manifold absolute pressure sensor. Different kettle of fish, you have said that it is starting in the garage, therefore remember the golden rules
1. Check to see if you have a spark at plugs.. if so,coilpack and leads ok then.
If not...In order of probability Fuel rail relay/manifold absolute pressure sensor or connection, this will cause intermittent starting, sometimes months will pass. Symptoms are, car not starting, and then starts later on or next day, without any problems.Then flywheel sensor, lasts approx 125,000 to 150,000 miles usually, then camshaft position sensor.
2. If you have a spark and still does not start, check you are getting fuel. If not check fuses and relay and pump for activation noise.
3. Remove ecu and clean connections, you can attempt to reset the ecu by disconnecting the battery for 24 hours, remove ecu if doing this,(best calling me first for clarification...methinks).
4.We know that there are other factors, injectors, split or damaged hoses or pipework,timing etc etc.
What I have written above (longwinded I know) are the tried and tested methods and sequence, REMEMBER most starting issues will not show up during a diagnostic, and you will still have to pay the garage, check all of the above and fix or fit to the best of your skills if your car still doesn't start AT LEAST you will have eliminated some of the problem areas.PHEW...ANY PROBS GET ME AT...your@themaddam.wanadoo.co.uk.

[jonj]

Got it back from the garage again yesterday, it has been fine the whole time they had it. I have replaced the CAM shaft sensor now aswell so there isn't really any thing else it can be.

I'll let you know next time it packs up!!!!

[jonj]

Guess what!!!!

Drove it to work this morning and it never started again!

Exactly the same thing, engine turns over but won't start. The alarm LED is flashing fast for 15 seconds and the car won't start.

I managed to get Green Flag to recover it (again, 4th time) and dropped it off to the Volvo garage. They tested it when it arrived and it didn't work s I left it with them over night. They called me today to say the got it in the garage this afternoon and it started, they can't find anything wrong with it!

I am fuming!!!!

I have read lots of things about this with other peoples cars, has anyone managed to sort their problems out?

[MIKESC70T5]

I'm 200% behind Paul on this one. My car was a non runner too with all the same symptoms as yours. The garage replaced sensors and a coil/amp etc all to no avail and one quick call to "paul the Volvo fixing Guru" later and it ran!
The problem with mine wasn't the actual relay but the wires on the connector to the relay. I've seen this problem on one other post here.
Trust Paul, use the force!!!

Exactly the same problem i had,one of the wires which plugged into the connector had split apart.I used a terminal block to reconnect them and the car started instantly. By the way the wires were wrapped up in some sort of sleeving so i had to cut this back a couple of inches. Paullyp really knows his stuff.

[Supragal]

Been through that, sadly it's not. :(

[Paullyp]

If I remember you have changed the usual parts, coilpack,flywheel and cam sensor. I can only have a guess that you may have a faulty ECU, the next time it fails to start remove the ECU spray wd40 on the ECU pins and the connecting plugs in the ECU box, failing that, check that there is fuel at the rail, if there is I can only suggest changing your distributor cap and the coil lead. If you want give me a call and we will go through it again,P

[jonj]

I am thinking ECU now too, how much would an ECU cost me?

[Paullyp]

I am thinking ECU now too, how much would an ECU cost me?

Second hand are £80-120,P

[jonj]

Okay thank you.

I went and had a chat with the main dealer yesterday after work. It seems the fault is becoming more and more frequent, as a result it is becoming more difficult to diagnose.

They have excluded the Immobilser which is good. They drive it for about 30 mins, bring it back to the garage and allow it to stand for 15 mins and then it fails. They quickly plug it in and begin running tests on each component/circuit individually and then all of a sudden it jumps into life? Then they have to start the process again, some days it is perfect and never fails.

I can't stop thinking that the first garage that looked at it (RT Mechanics) had it for a few days and never managed to start it, then it went to the main dealer and they couldn't start it either until they removed the ECU and replaced it. Ever since then it has been on and off most days. Immediately after they cleaned the ECU it was ok for about 3 days. Now it stops working most days.

Sounds like something electrical around the ECU to me, maybe one of the pins on the ECU, maybe a break in a wire from one of the components sending a signal to the ECU.

They are plugging it into their 'Black box' today and hopefully this will say which signal is missing which pin of the ECU.

[Adge]

Fingers crossed jonj. Must be an absolute pain in the a..... You do all you can to resolve a problem and still it beats you!

[Paullyp]

I hope they find the missing signal but don't bet on it, give me a bell or send me the part number on your ECU,I also need your engine size and spec, ie air con, 20 valve, manual or auto etc etc, I still have a few tricks up my sleeve,P.

[V70Man]

There's nothing worse than an intermittent fault, extremely hard to find.

I had the same problem with a previous car, and it turned out to be the immobiliser. Took donkey's years to resolve when someone finally noticed that everytime it wouldn't start the alarm/immobiliser light on the dash was flashing. :troutslap

I'm not saying that's your problem, but it does make me feel for you. My car only failed 3 times in the year, but one was just before boarding a ferry. I had an hour to try and start it but nothing. I called the AA out but missed my ferry. I was so embarrassed as I was in a queue and all the cars had to try and drive round me. Then to make matters worse when the AA arrived it started first fu**ing time!! Grrrrr. Typical. :cuckoo:

[jonj]

This is all sounding very familiar. Sometimes the light on the dash flashes like mad but it doesn't do it all the time and it doesn't always do it when it won't start. Sometimes it will start and the LED will still flash. I mentioned it to the garage but it hasn't done it since? It better not be that? I will call them again to remind them it was doing that.

How did you fix your in the end?

[jonj]

I hope they find the missing signal but don't bet on it, give me a bell or send me the part number on your ECU,I also need your engine size and spec, ie air con, 20 valve, manual or auto etc etc, I still have a few tricks up my sleeve,P.

Thanks paul, I can't get the part number from the ECU as the car is still at the main dealer.

It is a 2.5 10 valve, manual. Although it has aircon now it didn't come with it, it was fitted about 2 years ago. It is a 97 P.

Let me know if you need anything else?

[Paullyp]

Once you have the part number send it to me, I will then get back to you with a little known secret, that I will pass on to you when you give me a call. Don't want any sneaky dealers learning my tricks,P.

[jonj]

Ok thank you. I will call the dealer today for a progress update.

[Adge]

Every time a see a posting on this link from jonj I get a buzz as I'm expecting an inspired solution.
Really feel for you !

[jonj]

I am glad you feel entertained by it :) I feel drained by it. If I ever get to the bottom of this I will let you know I promise.

There cannot be much more to check!

[Paullyp]

I am glad you feel entertained by it :) I feel drained by it. If I ever get to the bottom of this I will let you know I promise.

There cannot be much more to check!

Wanna bet,P.:worried:

[Adge]

Wanna bet,P.:worried:
That's no way to encourage the poor bloke.lol
It's great the way people, especially paullyp in this case, rally round and look for reasons and solutions.
Well done folks!

[jonj]

Apparently they think they have found it! (I will believe it when I see it) They said it is a 'control module?' I will get full details and the bill this morning so i will keep you posted!

[jonj]

It's great the way people, especially paullyp in this case, rally round and look for reasons and solutions.
Well done folks!

Yes you are right thank you everyone you have been a great help.

[jonj]

Ok I have the answer!!!!

ECU

Bill = &#163;975 + vat

[t5owner]

Ok I have the answer!!!!

ECU

Bill = £975 + vat

Ouch thats not nice at all

Hope this resolves all your probs mate

Cheers

stuart

[Adge]

Well I was hoping we'd have a party to celebrate!! You've no money left now though! I thought they'd checked the ECU!!??

[jonj]

Me too! They had checked it buit they couldn't confirm it. They confirmed it yesterday when they swapped my ecu into another car and the fault moved with it.

Party?....I'm nearly homeless.

Paid &#163;2,000 for the car, I have driven it for about four days in the 4 weeks i have owned it and I have spent &#163;2,500 getting it sorted!

Anyway I'll let you know how it is!

[Adge]

Could have done a swap in the early stages! That's what many people on here offer to do to help each other!. Strange.... Your S40 (!?) looked nice and then you move up(!?) to this!

[Paullyp]

I smell a rat, get a second hand ECU....cost &#163;120-150